Does systemic racism exist?

[Mr. Johnson]

AB,

Legally, there is a difference between a migrant and a refugee. Migrants choose to leave their country but refugees have no choice because of threat of harm. The laws that you are citing apply only to migrants. For refugees that are also asylum seekers there are no limits in numbers that can be accepted under US law.

Read this article https://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/us-immigration/how-many-people-can-get-asylum.html

 

[AgnosticBoy]

I tend to revisit important issues to see if I can come up with a better perspective. I think I finally come up with a reasonable perspective that I can use examine a lot of issues dealing with race. I still don't think that systemic racism exist, but the effects of it from past times (stemming from when racism was legal) does exist. And of course, racism still exists in isolated cases.

In order for me to say that something is systemic would depend on the level that it is occurring on. For instance if it's built into the system (in the rules and policies), then I'd consider something like that systemic because it would mpact how everyone follows those rules and apply it. But if it's just a lot of people in an organization or institution that's doing it, then I'd rather say that particular group or individual is the problem as opposed to concluding that the institution is racist.

Some might say that it's the people (those running it) that make up the organization, but I would also think the rules also determines the institution as well. If the institution had systemic racism, then whichever group you put in place to run it would be racist. But if you switch the group and you no longer have racism, while under the same rules, then that's not a systemic problem but rather it's a problem of certain individuals being racist.

 

[Mr. Johnson]

Systemic racism is easy to spot if one does the research. According to NAACP,

• 32% of the US population is represented by African Americans and Hispanics, compared to 56% of the US incarcerated population being represented by African Americans and Hispanics.

• In 2014, African Americans constituted 2.3 million, or 34%, of the total 6.8 million correctional population.
• African Americans are incarcerated at more than 5 times the rate of whites.
• The imprisonment rate for African American women is 2x that of white women.

Can you guess the numbers that post bond by race? What everyone should know! According to PrisonPolicy.org

Most of these studies find that Black and brown defendants are 10-25% more likely to be detained pretrial or to receive financial conditions of release. Median bond amounts, when compared, are often about $10,000 higher for Black defendants compared to white defendants.

 

[AgnosticBoy]

Systemic racism is easy to spot if one does the research. According to NAACP,


Can you guess the numbers that post bond by race? What everyone should know! According to PrisonPolicy.org

Those are just stats, but my first question would the cause for those numbers. One answer is racism. There is another potential answer, and that is the quality of the attorneys. It's no secret that if you hire a good attorney, then you increase your chances of staying out of jail, and even getting away with a crime. Here is one piece of information from one of your sources:

7. More than three-quarters of criminal cases in the United States require the public provision of counsel. Criminal defendants of color are more likely to utilize publicly funded defense services than white defendants in light of racial disparities in income, wealth, and access to opportunity discussed elsewhere in this report. As a result, the crisis in America’s public defense system has a disproportionate impact on communities of color. The dramatic under-funding and lack of national standards governing America’s indigent defense services has made people of color second class citizens in the American criminal justice system, and constitutes a violation of the U.S. Government's obligation under Article 2 and Article 5 of the Convention to guarantee “equal treatment” before the courts.

17. Members of minority races utilize indigent defense services more than any other racial group because they are more likely to live in poverty as a result of multiple factors articulated in other sections of this report, most notably the section on structural racism. In 2002, the percentage of non-Hispanic whites living in poverty was 8%, while the percentage of non-Hispanic blacks living in poverty was 23.3% and the percentage of Hispanics living in poverty was 21.8%.43 With respect to the utilization of indigent defense services, these disparities only increase. For example, in Alabama in 2001, just under 60% of defendants using the indigent defense system were black, despite the fact that African-Americans only make up 26% of the state’s population.44 Overall, 77% of black inmates in state prisons reported having had lawyers appointed for them by the court, whereas only 69% of white inmates report

Source: Prison Policy

There's definitely some classism going on. Anyone of any race would have to resort to a public defender if they couldn't afford a private attorney.

 

[Mr. Johnson]

Anyone of any race would have to resort to a public defender

Funny this was not highlighted

As a result, the crisis in America’s public defense system has a disproportionate impact on communities of color. The dramatic under-funding and lack of national standards governing America’s indigent defense services has made people of color second class citizens in the American criminal justice system, and constitutes a violation of the U.S. Government's obligation under Article 2 and Article 5 of the Convention to guarantee “equal treatment” before the courts.

When policy affects one group disproportionately what would you call it? Don't expect them to make it obvious that it is racism.

 

[AgnosticBoy]

When policy affects one group disproportionately what would you call it?

If the definition of racism involves any policy or act that harms or negatively affects a lot of minorities, then I would agree with your point. I think the obvious problem is that we have different definitions for racism. Something that negatively affects a lot of minorities is not automatically racism in my book, although it would be bad for other reasons, like classism. When a system or policy is racist, I wouldn't expect minorities to be able to succeed under it. Or I would expect all minorities to automatically be affected by it.

The case that you're bringing up is based on income level and not race. Sure, it affects a large portion of a race, but it does not do so because of their race. An exception would be if somebody intentionally made such rules to target most minorities.

Again, I'm not saying that it's good policy just because it's not racism. There are other labels that describe that type of bad policy, and one is 'classism.'

 

[Mr. Johnson]

Does systemic racism exists in the United States?

Utah? smh

A woman hired to investigate racial harassment in a Utah school district says she experienced it herself

Joscelin Thomas was part of a wave of hires brought in to investigate reports of persistent racial harassment of Black and Asian American students.

www.nbcnews.com

"A Black woman hired by a northern Utah school district to investigate racial harassment complaints the year after a 10-year-old Black student died by suicide says that she, too, experienced discrimination from district officials.

Joscelin Thomas, a former coordinator in the Davis School District’s equal opportunity office, alleges in a federal lawsuit that district staff treated her “as if she were stupid,” accused her of having a substandard work ethic and denied her training and mentorship opportunities that were offered to her white colleagues.

“From the beginning of her employment, Dr. Thomas was treated differently than her lighter-skinned and non-Black coworkers and was subject to a hostile work environment,” the complaint states."

 

[AgnosticBoy]

Does systemic racism exists in the United States?

Utah? smh

A woman hired to investigate racial harassment in a Utah school district says she experienced it herself

Joscelin Thomas was part of a wave of hires brought in to investigate reports of persistent racial harassment of Black and Asian American students.

www.nbcnews.com

"A Black woman hired by a northern Utah school district to investigate racial harassment complaints the year after a 10-year-old Black student died by suicide says that she, too, experienced discrimination from district officials.

Joscelin Thomas, a former coordinator in the Davis School District’s equal opportunity office, alleges in a federal lawsuit that district staff treated her “as if she were stupid,” accused her of having a substandard work ethic and denied her training and mentorship opportunities that were offered to her white colleagues.

“From the beginning of her employment, Dr. Thomas was treated differently than her lighter-skinned and non-Black coworkers and was subject to a hostile work environment,” the complaint states."

That's a sad case. I work for a healthcare facility and one thing that helped to smooth employee relations is diversity training. Once a year, we have to complete a course (usually 30 mins. to an hour) that not only lists different social groups but also how all should be treated. If I remember correctly, the course mentions to avoid sensitive topics at the workplace.

I'll have to take notes on it next time and share some of the ideas here.

A diversity training program aims to boost participants' awareness about different types of diversity, appreciating differences among co-workers, and provide knowledge and strategies to enhance employees' interpersonal and communication skills across diversity to help build a positive work environment.

Source: https://extension.psu.edu/diversity...rogram aims,build a positive work environment.

I think stuff like that should be taught in schools, as well.