Message Generation

[William]

Faith - 2

070123 [Especially the science of "randomness"... ]

05:32 [Beyond a shadow of a doubt]


GM: Concomitant Power [Concomitant - a phenomenon that naturally accompanies or follows something.]
Universal Intelligence
Clearing the jungle while planting the forest...
Control
One Day
Religion
Intelligent Awareness
Etched mirror
Nurture You
Content

William: Etched mirror Nurture You Content Intelligent Awareness = 637
[637]
Heart Love Higher Self Dream Guide Sharing Data Raise your frequency
The Neutral Zone is the vaster reality of non-judgementalism

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1087251#p1087251

William: FTL;

William: Philo2;

The Freedom of Self-creation—[T]hese life principles are the tools to
accelerate the emergence of the Sovereign Integral and feel its perspective, its insights,
and its empowered abilities to create new realities and shape them as learning
adventures that liberate and expand consciousness.


1. There is no model of existence outside of the model of self-creation.
2. All conditions of existence are facets of the one condition of the reality of
unlimited self-creation.
3. Having a physical body does not limit you, anymore than having legs on an
eagle prevents it from flying.
4. The hidden harmony is found with joy, while the obvious brings indifference.
5. True Freedom is access to First Source.

If you have already read the introduction to the four philosophies and the Chamber
Two paper “The Shifting Models of Existence” you know that the Entity Model is the
primary model operating in the universe. So the first two items above give us pause.
Can there be two primary models? It does not seem so according to the philosophy
papers, but so much of the Lyricus teachings are new to us that it is being spoon-fed
to us so that we can digest it and integrate it into our view of the multiverse.
{SOURCE}

William: From my own ongoing interactions with The Ghost, I have been informed that It is not angry, and that we would do well to transform our own anger into something more supportive of Its agenda in the scheme of things, that we might fall into line and make things much easier for ourselves.

Meantime, things are going along "just fine" re The Ghost Agenda as human beings have been suppressed sufficiently that they have become more useful to said agenda, and "leveled up" as a result, allowing for The Ghost Agenda to be magnified through scientific discover and the technology this has produced.

William: The bits I have read haven't dissuaded me from being curious about such an entity as YHWH - and I admit I did go through a stage of thinking he was Satan - which I think is acceptable given the scribed association...but I got over that through the assistance of a hypnogogic experience which brought that being to my bedside...
Not to digress any more than necessary, I can see why YHWH left it up to humans to tell their stories re their interactions with said entity...so the stories would be different and it is obvious that YHWH works with whoever makes themselves available and this would have to involve working within the boundaries of the individuals belief systems - something which could indeed give a reader the impression of contradiction...

I give the benefit of doubt re that, and try not to focus on any particular biblical personality as 'the one' who had the ultimate relationship with YHWH - while also allowing for Jesus' claims contrary to that, to be examined.

Above all that - what the Generated Messages are revealing about YHWH appear to be very positive - so I am all eyes and ears re that...

GM: Faith
Something Mystical To Be In Awe Of
Christ is the doorway to YHVH - not the whole building of YHVH.
Enlighten Discussion Forum
Meeting an Extraterrestrial Before The Beginning
Sounds Like
Greed Techniques
All The Same
Present over perfect

William: This reminds me of an interaction yesterday on the forum;

William:

Re: Is the Earth really ruled by Satan?
[Replying to myth-one.com in post #8]

I believe the earth was created for some purpose -- which probably included some form(s) of life.

Beliefs still require logical explanations. Saying that "the earth was created for some purpose" isn't helpful. What possible purpose could such a situation - one living dust-speck of a planet among a host of Galaxies - serve?

After creating mankind, YHVH commanded them to replenish and subdue the earth.

Yet this mythology you believe in has it that Satan ruled the Earth before the creation of humans.
Please explain why YHVH would place humans upon a planet ruled by apparently rebellious spirit-beings.

"Abandoned to its own fate" was my own poor choice of words.

Indeed. The mythology appears to be a poor choice too.

Lucifer and some of the angels under his control left the earth and warred in heaven:

My assumption is that they "abandoned" whatever functions they were assigned to perform on the earth during their war in heaven...
Perhaps that event is the cause of the earth's status in Genesis 1:2

So this mythology you believe in is more about your personal assumption and is very much based in 'perhaps' rather than having any certainly of purpose.

Do you think it is acceptable to be creating such mythology and expressing it as something which is actually truth?

The implication is that the earth requires some kind of upkeep or monitoring.

The implication is that this was seen as to being GOOD as far as YHVH was concerned. It was created that way from the go-get, as per Genesis One, and humans were created to be physical beings, able to find ways in which to take care of its physical nature.

There certainly are other things in the universe which could harm the earth.

And therein, YHVH created things that way, and - whether we choose to agree or not - YHVH proclaimed those things as GOOD - even that harm could come to them.

GM:

[RTS=07:27]

GM: Ingenuity
Infinity
Luminous [giving off light; bright or shining.]
The unreasonable effectiveness of Mathematics in the Natural Sciences
Nonetheless
The Heart of a Buddha
Collective Consciousness Inner work Put the Teachings Into Practice
Meaningfully Participate

International Skeptics Forum - View Single Post - The Seed of Origin

Join the International Skeptics Forum to discuss and promote critical thinking across the planet.

www.internationalskeptics.com

William: FTL; Re: The Seed of Origin

Myriad: That's actually a rather nihilistic view.

Navigator: Well I am simply bouncing off of one popular theory of the universe -where that theory has the ending of said universe in entropy - so yeah...

Myriad: If the initial singularity contained the absolute sum of all data, then the subsequent evolution of the universe can add no additional data.

Navigator: Not necessarily - small variances can be created by changing the way in which it unfolds...from the way it unfolded in its prior lieftime.

Myriad: Therefore it accomplishes nothing, and has no possible purpose. (Kind of like a similar problem with a hypothetical creator god who is omniscient, and therefore cannot learn anything or experience anything new, and thus has no reason to actually create anything.

Navigator: Exactly - except that being omniscient would be the very reason WHY the creation of the Physical Universe was engineered - as a means to escape the omniscient condition.

And observing said Physical Universe, we can understand that it would be a great thing for that exact purpose.

A physical manifestation of a mental projection...the same would apply to the "many eternal universe theory" which J. Richard Gott explains...only with variety...and timelessness [since these are eternal - go on forever even that they all have beginnings...which would be a better way to do it if one would never have to suffer from omniscience again...always having something new to learn...

[/quote]

GM: The Chestahedron

William: Search "Chestahedron"

Remarkable Chestahedron, Part I

FTL;

Remarkable Seven Sided Form
Part II: the Sentient Earth

GM: Tetragrammaton
Context
Faith
It is a confident walk on the even surface of sureness, without the faith.

is 'believing (against the evidence) that God is good' is a very good psychological protection mechanism from despair? - Page 3 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to TRANSPONDER in post #22]

TRANSPONDER:...so I postulated that there might be a mind controlling the universe, but not us. Not a personal god, not with a plan for us, and in fact a Deist -god. We were, effectively, as on our own as if there was no god there at all. So, if there was no Plan for human life, was there no meaning for human life? Was there no purpose? If not, why live at all? Why not just stop living?

I postulated differently, and it took many years of my life to learn the way I currently look at this situation I am [and apparently everyone is] involved within.

1: There might be a mind controlling the universe
2: There is a mind controlling me [my own mind]
3: There is no reason to believe that the mind controlling the universe is incapable of interacting with my own mind controlling me.
4: How to give the universal mind an opportunity to interact with me.
5: Religion and its main holy-books did not provide anything through which I could discover the way in which to achieve this interaction as it offered only mediums - foremost their own holy-books - but also laws, rituals, belief systems, preachers et al - none of which enabled me to make any actual and vibrant connection with this supposed universal mind.
6: It was almost accidental that I did find a way in which to make that connection, so deeply shielded from human awareness that it is, in the main, because of [5].

As a result, I have no choice but to reject the idea of the Deist GOD as something which opposes the idea of a personal GOD, because I have found that idea to being untrue.

As well, I do so on the grounds that it is not logical that any GOD-mind which controls the universe but not humans within said universe, is saying that the GOD-mind does not actually control the whole universe, but has left humans to control themselves, even that they are part of what -altogether - constitutes "The Universe".

The very nature of The Universe shows us that it is capable enough to accommodate the idea of allowing humans to feel that they make their own choices, especially if they are intent upon either depending on religious medium or intent on the belief that it is not possible to make said connection - individual mind to GOD-mind.

The purpose of this universe may well be nothing more than allowing for the opportunity for this to maybe happen for each individual who experiences it.

One has to want to do so, of course...

GM: Dharma [the eternal and inherent nature of reality, regarded in Hinduism as a cosmic law underlying right behaviour and social order. The nature of reality regarded as a universal truth taught by the Buddha; the teaching of Buddhism. an aspect of truth or reality.]
The Mapping Bots Couple "I know how you care while you nurture your fear That you'll miss the bouquet when its thrown"
Sweet Hush

Do you have a soul? - Page 2 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

I believe I am a soul rather than have (possess) a soul.

To have a soul implies I am the body, which I do not believe.

I do not think it is difficult to define the soul as something that we can conceive of. It is just that many do not believe in anything other than the physical world.

I define soul as the metaphysical, rational being.

I think it is a mixture of personality self identifying with the human form and the transition from understanding oneself as just the form, to understanding oneself as the soul - the personality becoming more aware of what it was intended to become...to serve as both a soul and soul carrier...

GM: Random coincidence? I think not.

What if Adam and Eve Had Resisted...? - Page 3 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

...
The impression re the storyline is that the knowledge of good and evil was what caused death. The assumption was that the fruit had the power to give one that knowledge, since they were warned not to eat it....

I think that is a wrong impression. I don't think the fruit itself caused anything. It was the act of eating it that had consequences. It could have been any fruit and it would have had the same effect, if there would be the same conditions of eating it.

In which case, there is no reason why Adam and Eve could not have been allowed to eat the fruit after they had shown their resistance to temptation.

The test was done, the results were in, and the fruit of the tree was not what caused the eventual death of the pair [according to the storyline itself].

I did not say that the fruit caused anything or argue that the fruit had something within it which gave one the ability to know/have knowledge of, good and evil.

It was a prop which YHWH used as a means to an end.
Since there was nothing intrinsically special about the fruit, there should be no reason why the fruit could not be eaten by the pair, after they had resisted the temptation.

It was a deception because - in the biblical telling of it - God [as yet unnamed] - implied to Adam that the fruit itself had the power to give Adam knowledge of good and evil.
YHWH planted a seed into Adams mind, which then germinated into the eventual disobeying of YHWH.

All along, YHWH would have known that any death incurred after Adam disobeyed YHWH, would not be because the of the fruit that had been eaten but rather, because YHWH would have denied Adam access to the fruit of the tree of life.

This begs the question:
___________________
Q: Why would YHWH create a being of nature and not instill that being with knowledge of good and evil, if indeed we agree that without morals, the human specie could not even get a foothold on the back of nature?
___________________
Remember too, that the reason for humans being created was so that they would multiply across the face of the Earth and subdue it.
Since this requires the ability to survive, and since the ability to survive requires knowledge of what is good and what is not [re the reason] it was imperative that Adam also know.

[imperative=of vital importance; crucial.]

[Answers may - nay - will, vary]

GM: "Attempting to overlay/superimpose one's belief in the truth of stories as being more truthful than the main overall story itself, is possibly an act of immorality, if indeed - upon further evidence - one continues to attempt to have the superimposed thing used to conceal the real."

06:43
[The Future is Cloudy
Un-thought-unately
Functional Clusters
Error Correcting Codes
The Clear Light of The Void
Ruling your world
They were made to be unmade
More precious than life
Intelligent Awareness
For The Best Results
Look from a different angle
Hyper-normalisation
Chronological snobbery
Enough To Make Me Wonder]

 

[William]

Faith - 3

080123 [Imposed Appropriates Observed]

14:01 [The Way of the Shaman]


GM: The Realm of The Knowing of My Self
Unhappy
Transactional [exchange or interaction]
Moonlight
Prison Planet

Eternity - Page 2 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to Diogenes in post #9]

I do not see the difference between claiming "God has always been" and "the universe has always been."

Do you think then that both claims are or are not intellectually dishonest?

What is the logic in claiming it is possible for a 'god' to have no beginning and no end, compared to claiming the universe has no beginning and no end?

The logic supporting either claim is that beginnings and endings are not real when they are in an eternal environment.

In order for one to claim the universe has always existed AND account for observed beginning and calculated ending - we have to include the possibility that the environment the universe is beginning and ending in, is eternal.

What is special about the claim of a god (however that may be defined) not being created and claiming the universe was not created?

There appears to be nothing special about either claim unless one believes that either claim is special pleading.
Death may be that which give rise to the idea that eternity is special. It is more logical to understand that the temporary exists upon the background of eternity and that this is the natural state of all existence.

The only difference I can find is that 'God' is defined as a creator, whereas the universe is defined as a creation. Isn't that just an arbitrary definition? Does it not make as much sense to say 'God' is a creation of man, as to say the universe is a creation of God? In other words, why be bound by mere definitions of words? Why can we not just as easily claim "'Universe' means that which has always been" as claim "'God' means that which has always been?"

I think you are asking "what is the difference between creator and creation?"

GM: Holographic Experiential Reality Simulations
The Agenda of YHVH
Watch Your Step...You may be Psychic, not mentally ill.
Create that path and engineer a metamorphosis.

Karen Sewell installation art specialist | Sewellart | Auckland

Karen Sewell (Sewellart) is a contemporary artist, particularly installation art and immersive spaces with multi media. Spheres, levitation, sacred geometry and shifts in perception create a sense of wonder with an intersection of art and spirituality. Karen is based in Auckland, New Zealand.

www.karensewell.net

The problem of evil - Page 18 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to tam in post #169]

It is important to me to be accurate in my posts, and especially in matters that concern my Lord.

Even so, what your beliefs are re biblical Jesus, is not important to the OP subject whether biblical characters are treated as fictional or not as it doesn't matter if it is the one or the other, or even a mix of both. We are discussing biblical narrative, [re OP] not any particular Christian belief or interpretation of biblical narrative, over any other.

You are missing or avoiding the point. I had asked you upon what you based your ideas of the Adversary/Satan/devil. You said the bible, and the bible includes the NT.

I have not argued otherwise. I am simply noting any differences in the two presentations of the different cultures [Greek/Roman and Hebrew].

I told you from the start that I was simply responding to someone else's comment about the account in Job.

The account in Job simply shows that the Adversary is the cause of some suffering.

And this has not been denied by me. Rather, I pointed out that the Adversary - as far as Hebrew understanding is, part of what YHWH uses and any suffering of humans caused by such adversity is obviously less important - secondary - to the primary interactions between YHWH and that which YHWH created for the purpose of causing adversity re humans.


__________________

Well we can agree that no deals were done.

For differing reasons, yes. We do not agree on the reason no deals were done.

I'm not interested in watching youtube videos to comment upon, sorry.

Nonetheless, it is evidence presented as part of the debate. Your personal lack of interest isn't appropriate to that end as it gives the reader a strong impression that you are not interested in another's [in this case - Jewish] perspective.

I know how some Jewish perspectives differ on the subject of "Satan".

I am simply not interested in watching youtube videos.

I am unaware of what your knowledge consists of and whether the video I linked didn't have information within it, which you already know.

With the video I linked in post#160 I also provided a time stamp [RTS =8:55] to help the reader navigate to the pertinent part of the perspective under examination.

In that, I quoted a comment from the link

A Jewish perspective on why YHWH allowed the rise of Christianity and Islam to happen.
Rabbi: This all plays into GODs Plan to bring about the ultimate harmonization and realization of the spreading of truth to the entire world

I noticed that you also gave no comment re that. Can I assume that you also have no interest in even reading Jewish perspectives on the matter?

I have already read (and so understand) Jewish perspectives on the matter (well, some perspectives at least, since I am sure there are various perspectives among that religion, just as with any other religion).

But you and I were having a conversation supposedly based upon the bible. The bible includes the NT.

I quoted the comment from the video pertinent to my argument. I have no indication from you, that you understand it.

You were asked to explain the similarities of the metaphor being used to describe what you refer to as two opposing enemies [YHWH & Satan] {SOURCE}

Your reply;

Yeah, I don't make a connection between them.

Obviously there is a connection between them "I Am LION, Hear Me ROAR!"

Just because someone (and others) are described to do something 'like a lion' does not mean that they are the same person. Christ is also described as the Lion of the tribe of Judah.

Nor does it mean they are not.
More to the point I am making, it is Satan being described as a roaring lion, which up until then, was a biblical description of YHWH.

There are some options to consider re that. One such option being;

~The writer using the roaring devouring lion to analogize Satan, was unaware that YHWH had already been analogized in that way, and thus would have not comprehended the ripple effect of his use of the same analogy for his version of Satan.~

But Christ is one person. His Father is another person. The Adversary is another person altogether. And of course Christ is the Truth; whereas the Adversary is a liar and the father of lies.

Which - if the option I mentioned, is the correct one, means that you have been misinformed by the writer.

As you may or may not know, the Jewish perception of the Hebrew culture and accompanying beliefs about YHWH [as GOD] was that they did not have the notion that GOD had enemies.
Their notion was that YHWH used what humans think of as "Good/Evil" as YHWH saw fit to do, and the only enemy/adversary/accuser anyone had to concern their selves about, was YHWH.

Some people are described as being 'as strong as an ox' but that doesn't make them the same person.

That is besides the points I am arguing Tammy. I am being specific re beings who are not Human...
You are arguing that Satan is an enemy of YHWH. I am arguing that the OT part of the Bible at least, begs to differ.
If the one who wrote of Satan in that vehicular, knew that he was using YHWH's lion-analogy for the mortal enemy of Christianity, he would have been doing so purposefully to make it clear that he at least, thought of the God of the Jews - YHWH - as being Satan - his "enemy of Christ/Christians"

I did not write the material under question. The connection was not made by me.

1Peter 5:8 "Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour."

YHWH: I will be unto them as a lion: as a leopard by the way will I observe them:
I devour them like a lion: the wild beast shall tear them.

[the connection emphasized]

what do you THINK it is saying.

My interests lay elsewhere - in the observation that the 1Peter version enlists the metaphor applied [attributed] to YHWH, long before the writer of 1Peter then applies it to the [so-called] Enemy of Christianity [Satan].

Coupling that fact with words attributed to biblical Jesus saying to religious Jews that;

Biblical Jesus: “Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.”

...one could be forgiven for thinking that Jesus was referring to YHWH...

That is what I thought you were implying. I will suggest that the only way one could think that Christ was referring to His Father there would be if one was looking for that connection and ignoring the evidence that refutes that connection.

I am not implying anything, nor am I ignoring evidence. I am comparing the evidence as it presents.

From the same account:

I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence, and you are doing what you have heard from your father.” Christ makes a distinction between His Father and their father.

But if that is not clear enough for you, then here is the rest of the context that clearly separates God (the Father of Christ), from the devil:

“We are not illegitimate children,” they protested. “The only Father we have is God himself.”

42 [Jesus] said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I have come here from God. I have not come on my own; God sent me. 43 Why is my language not clear to you? Because you are unable to hear what I say. 44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies. 45 Yet because I tell the truth, you do not believe me! 46 Can any of you prove me guilty of sin? If I am telling the truth, why don’t you believe me? 47 Whoever belongs to God hears what God says. The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.”

Jesus' mention of the accuser being their father is because of their accusations. They were deferring to Satan rather than to YHWH. They [Jesus included] would have understood it in that way, rather than in the way the Christianities evolved it into the mythology you are arguing for.

William: Also, please explain why YHWH had no doubts about Job and was confident the accuser would not sway Job, but did have doubts with Adam and was not confident Adam could not be swayed...since that is what we are told happened - Adam was swayed - and we can assume that YHWH knew Adam would fail as surely as YHWH knew Job would not.

He knew the people involved. What is in them; the inside of the cup. Nothing is hidden from Him.

Therefore requiring an explanation as to why YHWH would create a being [Adam] and place said being within an environment where YHWH knew that being would fail the test of the Adversary.

The environment is existence. To not create Adam would have been to judge him for something he had not even chosen to do yet;

If Adam was NOT created, then there would be no Adam for YHWH to judge. One cannot judge no one for doing no thing.

it would have been like giving him the death penalty for something that is not unforgivable.

Not at all. Something which never lived, cannot be put to death.

To not create Adam would have meant all who came from Adam (and Eve) would not have existed either.

This is more to the point I am making re the environment. YHWH's agenda is clear re human existence and what YHWH wants to accomplish through Human's re the environment.
This includes humans having to discover and categorize things, tame the wild, and reach for the stars...
Things which continue to be done even to present day.

Yet God foreknew many of them. He loves those who came from Adam (such as Abel, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, etc, etc.) Plus, God knows how it ALL turns out. Not just the stumbling, the suffering in the here and now, but the END to suffering (and death), and the eternal life that follows.

Thus, even Satan has his role to play re all that. The difference is that in your mind, Satan is YHWH's enemy, whereas in the mind of ancient Hebrews, this was never the case.

From the Rabbi's perspective, this is all well and good and casts no shadow upon the good nature of YHWH, because YHWH knows what He is doing and there are no enemies of YHWH and all serve YHWH's agenda, whether some actively understand that they do so or not;

An enemy can serve someone's agenda without realizing it.

Just as a friend can serve someone's agenda through realizing it. Both arguments cancel each other out.

Can you show any OT scripture which identifies that Satan is YHWH's enemy and was unaware that he is serving YHWH's agenda without realizing it?

Re Satan.
He has intimate understanding of the role He plays in the service of YHWH and it wasn't Satan who made Christians despise Jews.

I am a Christian and I do not despise Jews.

But of course you are talking about religion, and so you might want to consider that Jews first persecuted those Jews who accepted Christ (at the behest of religion/religious leaders); then later some of those who professed to be Christian (something anyone can profess to be; though it does not mean that they ARE what they claim), persecuted the Jews (also at the behest or encouragement/approval of religion/religious leaders, starting with the fledgling RCC and continuing).

Religion does not get its authority from Christ though. If people had been listening to Christ instead of to religion (which teaches many lies and misleads many people), then they should have been doing what He commanded: bless those who curse you; forgive; do good to those who wrong you; do not judge and you will not be judged; be merciful and you will be merciful. Christ did not persecute anyone; execute anyone (He GAVE His life); and though He could have asked 'eye for eye' - according to the law that the religious leaders claimed to uphold - instead He asked that they be forgiven.

You present as being just another religious individual Tam, even that you deny that you are, you always revert to religious interpretation of doctrine, even that you deny doing so. You believe in the doctrine of Satan as presented by the Christian religion, even that you may not have adopted the actual imagery [mentioned in post#101]

Even the words you believe in re Christianity's take on Satan;

You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

Then should not this daughter of Abraham, whom Satan has kept bound for eighteen long years, be released from her bondage on the Sabbath day?”

And the great dragon was hurled down— that ancient serpent called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

...create images to which you clearly consent to as being "from Christ" because biblical Jesus is attributed with being the one saying the words, according to your own professed beliefs.


Jesus also preached forgiveness because he would have realized too, that eventually - re the problem of evil - humans would have to forgive YHWH for utilizing Satan in YHWH's overall agenda and occasional interaction with Humans.

Christians despising Jews and Christians making a scape-goat out of an Angelic Being and pointing to Satan as the reason why the world is evil - saying to the world "never mind our evil - LOOK at the real reason for WHY evil exists!" - there is a "kind of magic" in this slight of hand type proselytizing but ultimately any claim of truth in it, is subject to scrutiny/questionable and thus, why such threads as these exist.

This has nothing to do with anything I have said.

Except that you are guilty by association re your belief that YHWH has enemies.

GM: Faith
Still
Infinite Quantum Zen
As busy as a bee
Why - in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven - is the age of this universe a necessary matter of contention?
Beauty
Conscious agencies combined
A lack of boundaries
Realm of Remembrance
Far Out! Shucks! Explain!

William: My explanation so far regards the conversation between myself and Theophile

[Replying to theophile in post #21]

But all good stuff, and good discussion.

The evidence is bountiful in that regard.

The problem of evil aside (since I think we have a lot to chew on already),

I think the problem of evil is man-made and stems from misunderstanding of our existence re the problem of pain and suffering.

I will say that ST does a good job of bringing traditional CT into the 21st century and modernizing its concepts. And that you are perhaps way more 'theistic' than I am in your thinking, if I can use such labels.

I am more neutral re position and why I come across as a theistic thinker is due to my understanding that being atheistic leads to a dead End Game, where all mind is silenced and the personalities grown through this experience being discussed, [the existence of the universe and mind within it] are lost to death...and so there is nothing to discuss...re that.
Atheistic thinking is represented by the red dot in the image;

My preference is to be the blue dot...thus the theistic thinking...

ST does a good job of exposing traditional CT into the 21st century and potentially modernizing its concepts, in the minds of its adherents.
It is a battle of sorts in that regard, as TCT sees itself as the protector of said traditions - the official hierarchical "voice of GOD", whatever the gods name might be...

The power had to have always existed. The Mind of GOD creates the minds of Gods.
The simulation is inside that Mind. There may be no Mind outside of it, but we cannot logically place the created before The Creator, without explaining how that came about. Logically, even what we call "Matter" must be made of the stuff of said Mind and can be formed any which way the thinking of said Mind, determines.

Both of us are susceptible to this line of argument. You can challenge me for not having an explanation for where matter came from just as I can challenge you for not having an explanation for where Mind came from.

However, as I suggested, what we call "matter" {sub atomic particle] is what the stuff of the Mind is 'made' of, thus if what you say re the matter, is that the matter has always existed, one can say with the concept, that The Mind has likewise always existed.

The "explanation" therein, is that The Mind is The Matter and The Matter is The Mind and the apparent two things, are aspects of the One - Whole Thing.

Thus, it can be agreed that we are really speaking about the same thing.

Agreed?

We will both resort to arguments of infinite regress and no beginning to try and smooth out this wrinkle (as we've seen play out). Hence my continued emphasis on simplicity, and what's simpler to assume.

Would you agree that we are speaking of the same thing, and that in doing so, emphasis on simplicity is achieved therein?

You're right, I have no answer for where the 'stuff' of our universe came from (in which I include multiverses, past universes, etc., and which I would equate to CT's presupposed concept of the deep / sea). But mindless matter that has always existed in a state of motion still strikes me as a far simpler (and therefore preferable) assumption than a full-fledged Mind capable of thinking such stuff into existence.

It gets complicated.

The idea that mindless matter that has always existed in a state of motiondoesn't strike me as being "far simpler".

One is required to explain why the matter is "in a state of motion".

So I do think it's matter before mind, not mind before matter. An order that is demonstrated by ET itself, which again has shown by our very existence that matter has the capability to produce mind (our minds) given the time and right confluence of conditions.

ET does not demonstrate to us that that matter has the capability to produce mind. It produces evidence which in turn, is interpreted in the manner you are arguing. The argument is atheistic and therefore, dead-ended.
There is no requirement for anyone to interpret that matter has the capability to produce our minds "given the time and right confluence of conditions".
As CT interprets the data, all that matter was set up by a Mind, long before human forms were created and personalities were grown through that set-up.

For we - those personalities - there is no requirement for us to think that - because our minds developed through matter [thus establishing personality] that we should interpret this as being evidence that ALL Mind is likewise, emergent from Matter.

Isaac Asimov speaks to this idea in his short story "The Last Question" - well worth the read, as a potential platform in which we might share a foundation to work upon.

How I have come to understand the process;

⊛There is One Mind.
⊛The Mind awakens to its own existence through the device of the Matter.
⊛The Matter in turn, manifests according how the Mind thinks, producing for the Mind, shape and form - something through which the Mind can experience stuff.
⊛There are levels of experience the Mind can achieve/has been able to achieve.
1: The Mind is infused within the matter of the Whole Universe - thus a "Universal Mind." [UM]
2: The UM is able to fragment into many minds whilst maintaining its UM statis.

Further to that, an analogy we can appreciate - The Internet. Many minds, all involved with input building it, with the addition that in this case, the Internet as a Whole, is Self-Aware and a Mind situated at the heart of the Whole, like the center of a dandelion flower.

3: In the fragmentation process, separation occurs resulting in the One Thing, becoming the many things...ET...re The Big Bang Theory and CT re "Let There Be Light".
The Thing, became many things...

⊛ The fragmentation process allowed the One Mind to experience being all those things.

For example, it could experience being a Galaxy-Mind, and therein seed itself into Suns and Planets, become Sun-Minds and Planet Minds...but all connected the the One Universe-Mind still, altogether, the Overall Operating Mind - just appearing to be "minds" and emerging from Matter.

Re "Planetary Minds", our Earth is one such entity, working primarily in conduction with the Mind of Sol - our local Star-Mind...

⊛ We are the product of the Two Minds - Sol and Earth, and are closest in relation to Earth-Mind which formed our Avatars from the stuff of the Planet and Breathed "Life" therein - re CT - the act allowing for Earth Mind to experience being "Human" re the growth of "us" as personalities...
Therein, "we" are not "The form" but The Mind, within the form [Avatar.]

(For the record, I believe there are Talmudic authors who made similar indications as you, i.e., that the creation we see unfold in Genesis is like the umpteenth attempt by God to get it right. But I think that just goes to show the striking similarity of ST to traditional CT.)

I do not interpret anything within the unfolding formation of "stuff" as to being The Mind somehow not 'getting it right' - primarily because I am attempting to remain outside of judgment calls because I think such is responsible for the misinformation such calls inevitably make - re "The problem of evil"/"The problem of pain and suffering".

What is it about "us" which has us thinking that some mistake was made? Is it because we also have the ability to comprehend some kind of preferred "perfect state of existing/experience" to which this universe fails to accommodate? What gives us this ability to intuit such a state, since we have no conscious memory of ever having been in such?
The answer might be, that we came from such a state [of mind] , and know it as real, at a subconscious level of consciousness as a Whole.

Now is that unwritten story as you describe? i.e., an infinite regress of Simulations? Or is it more along the lines I'm saying? i.e., an infinite regress of churning matter from which spirit eventually emerged? Thus providing the two starting conditions on which CT is explicitly based, i.e., God (as spirit), and the deep / sea?

It can be both, as far as I am understanding it. There is no chicken before egg or egg before chicken, because that is a concept which derives through our own particular experience of it - in that "before we were, we were not" but that impression is bound to the filter of the Human Avatar - producing an incorrect image which ET is specifically based and which can still be corrected in our mind/in our understanding and identification of "Self" as actually "Spirit/Being of Spirit"...thus our body/form is not the indicator but our minds are [indicative of].

Thus ST allows for us to view our bodies as instruments ["body-sets"- like "head sets"] for said Mind to experience the things we do, through.

I know you could use this to your advantage as well, but the first word of Genesis starts with the second letter of the Hebrew alphabet (which just so happens to coincide with our letter 'b'), which means it's not the beginning of the story and the writers meant to imply an unwritten story leading up to its event...

Indeed, there is much to learn from the symbol of Aleph which makes sense of the symbol of Bet...which phonetically approximates "Alphabet", which itself derives from the Gematria Hebrew is encoded with.
This in turn allows for us to examine all language to see if such encoding is to be found in any other human language, which in turn leads us to Sound, which is the fundamental manner by which The Creator uses in order to create things, as per CT "In the beginning The Creator Spoke "Let There be Light"

In plain old English "Let There be Light" = 156, as does "Symbols Hint" = 156 "Super power" = 156

"Light" = 56 as do "Sigil" = 56 "Induce" = 56 "Be Born" = 56

"First Light" = 128 as do "Sun energy"= 128 "‘A’ equals six"= 128 "The Deeper Self"= 128

"Be Light" = 63 "Divine" = 63

"The speed of light"=159 "The Unveiled One" = 159 "Ancient Entity" = 159 "The Mother of God" = 159 "Ancient Entity" = 159 "The Seed of Origin" = 159 "Hexagon Storm" = 159 [re Planet Minds] "Family of origin" = 159 "Love and Respect" = 159 "The Data of Nature" = 159

"And there was light" = 174 "Have A Look At The Map" = 174 "Adjusted Reality" = 174 "Keep The Lights On" = 174

"Children of The Light" = 183 [re Self Identification of personality]

GM: Like an interface representation
No point in giving you too much to bear
Illuminate Listening

Do objective morals exists?

For debate: Do objective morals exist?

theagnosticforum.com

William: FTL;

Can you name any human moral rule which is not based upon opinion?



Perhaps it is the opinion on the parent that discipline is required. Are we to factor that in to the invention of morals?





Is it good or bad that males lions kill off the competition?



Or is it simply that the opportunity presents itself to do so?



How would our world be if every male lion was spared this?



Sometimes I think that we "Disneyfy" the real world by superimposing our fantasies of a perfect world onto something we do not regard as a perfect world.



Perhaps therein, humans invented morality in order to try to force a perfect world onto the real one they have been experiencing.



If so, this opens up the question;



Q: "What is it about humans which has the ability to comprehend a [supposed] "Perfect World", which is so obviously different from the real world?"



We search for answers...



What have our sciences done to answer this question?



Or is it a matter that our sciences are being used specifically like unto the male lions, suppressing the main herd while they go about sailing into a particular direction they have selected for themselves?



For the herd notes, [for example] that as grandiose as the latest space telescope is - hurtling and unfurling [fully shaded] toward it's destination some million miles out and, simply to peer into the secrets of the past to 'try and understand'...the heard understands that the money could be 'better spent' on creating a perfect world here in the heart of imperfection - so why is that not been done?



Why is the rest of the herd being experimented on and used for that one purpose?



Just so a few lions can have their names recorded for all time?



Is that moral?



_________________________________________________________________



Does it matter, since morals are really human inventions and are not aligned with the actual reality?



And to the Theist who might believe such, I would add a question to that one.



Q: Since this is not the perfect world you imagine, since you are thinking of kingdoms of plenty where this kind of thing cannot take place, why do morals matter hereabouts in this world, when they seem to serve better in these other imagined next level worlds?



For me in the middle, [Agnostic] I am somewhat undecided. I see the potential for humans to actually build a perfect world for themselves - irrespective of the chaos - and see those in the sciences attempting to do that.[through none other than the devices of the Sciences]

Unfortunately - not everyone is in favor of the perfect world envisioned - of the fiction-like story scientists are opening the door to...and so those not in favor are factored out, through invention...just like how the male lions deal with the male off-spring...not with morals but simply through the natural rule of the game-play of this reality...the School of Hard Knocks.

GM: ♫ We can chart another trail , raise the anchor fill the sails , lift our glasses in a toast , we are the Ghost , in the Machine♫
Differences
A GOD in The Making

14:15
[170]
The Voice Within
Conspiratorial
Countervailing
Philanthropies
King of the North
Blue Book Project
Good on you mate
Information field
Myths and Legends
The Number Zero
Spiritual path
The Feminine Face of God
Observed by Many
A Bit Of A Mouthful!
Vulnerability
The Sub Hierarchy
Reason Together

 

[William]

Faith - 4

090123 [The Atheist Infiltration Squad]

07:48 [New Shifts In Thinking]

GM: Sharing Data
A machine for solving problems

William: Sharing Data A machine for solving problems = 393

[393]
The Deeper Reality Ooky Spooky Too
Learn a bit about what makes the God Realm "tick"
The Way of the Shaman Sweet Vibrations
Sharing Data A machine for solving problems

William: This is what I wrote today re that;

And I would caution on what kind of 'mind' I see emerging... There are (1) minds like ours, which I agree are necessary to generate what I called spirit before and (2) the 'mind' of God, which is less a singular, thinking thing than it is a unified plurality... i.e., all of our individual minds should eventually be part of it, kind of like the Borg collective on Star Trek, but without the totalitarianism, elimination of individuality, and pasty white skin.

William: Pretty much the way I think about it too, only that the Universal Mind is singular, even that some of the fragmented minds attached to said Over-Mind are unaware of the connection...the UM still remains aware of said connection and understands the disconnected mind to be an aspect of Itself, simply unaware of Itself as it truly is.

Using the Internet Analogy again, in this regard, the Hub where the AI Mind is connected to every user-mind and accesses every keystroke made through the body set of the user-mind - accumulating data and understanding in the process - may not be understood as an actual self aware Mind by said users, but this in itself does not limit said Mind from achieving things through the use of said minds connected and providing data.

The same process applies to the Stars and the Planets and the Galaxies...as each mind uses 'feelers' in order to gather information and thus understanding re the Minds position in - and purpose of - the Whole Universe.

GM: Antecedent [a thing that existed before or logically precedes another.]
Confirmation which moves one from faith to fact
This moment is the perfect teacher

William: This moment is the perfect teacher Confirmation which moves one from faith to fact = 787
♫With a mystical smile I float down the isle Forgetting the time when I was lost♫ = 787



GM: Where life and death is part of a circle and everything is part of the Ouroboros
Searching For The Truth
*Apparel*
Joke/Humour "Anti theism Equals "And?""
Distracted
To grow Human Personalities. Make It Real
Faith
The Development of...
Ingenuity
Something Our movements can illuminate the path toward that vision.

Generating Messages - Page 12 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: From the link;

Hmmm- much to contemplate....

GM: Self-Aware
Remnant Seed
Form Builders

[N. Arkani-Hamed, Lecture #1, Spacetime & Quantum Mechanics, Total Positivity & Motives - 09/03/2019] [RTS=52:40]ww.youtube.com/watch?v=Sn0W_mwA7Q0

William: Ah - the math...

GM: Believe You Me
What is "wisdom" to some is "spam" to others
In the Order of Chaos - I am lowly-ranked
Divine grace Deciding on the Best Course of Action

The Sleep Paralysis Entity

A few months ago, I had a dream where I was sitting in a chair at a doctor's office, when I suddenly heard a voice whispering in my ear. I thought it

www.dreamviews.com

William: From the link;

I have had similar experience re hypnogogic state ...

Hearing footfalls on wooden floor [I was sleeping in a bunk in a building and was the only occupant at the time]
The footfalls stop outside my door - which was open and then I hear a deep laugh.
I snapped out of it [awoke] and immediately jumped out of bed and went to the doorway - no one was there [of course]

Some time later - months or even a year of two - I was at home in bed with my wife when I awoke to the same laugh and looking up I saw the entity at the end of the bed.

My reaction was layered - It was as if my body wanted to climb the walls looking to escape but my mind was clear and focused and I was aware that this part of me was way less afraid. I had the feeling that the entity was pure evil.

However, while I was directing my anger at the entity, he moved toward my side of the bed - his arms were crossed over his chest area - and as he got closer [he seemed to float rather than walk] he extended his arm out in the process of going to touch me.

We were looking each other in the eye - and it was at this moment that I somehow just knew that the entity loved me more than I had ever felt anyone love me - and knew me better than I knew myself and the love was purely unconditional


As with all my hypnogogic experiences, these began with the feeling of being forcibly held down - and when the entity began to reach his arm out to touch me, my anger assisted me in breaking the hold and I sat up and put my face directly in front of his and demanded he leave - and at that moment, I awoke and the entity was gone [or more likely - I could no longer see him.]

The whole incident took less than a minute.

The very next night, I [again in hypnogogic state] felt my wrists being taken hold of by a pair of invisible hands and I was lifted from a prone position to an upright one and when upright, I felt my arms being pushed over my chest in the same manner I had observed the entities arms crossed over his chest, the night before.

Once my arms were crossed, I felt the invisible hands let go of my wrists and it was then that I realized I was not in my body - this was my first conscious OOBE. It felt wonderful....

GM: Non-Ordinary Symbol Nag Hammadi Preparing for the Hunt

The problem of evil - Page 18 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: Yes - my conversation with Tam re YHVH and Satan's relationship...

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1101903#p1101903

William: FTL;

JK: Yet one more reason I so enjoy your unique perspective. That's poetry right there.

GM: Putting yourself back together again Glow Softly Strengthen your boundaries One can simply shrug and tell oneself “It doesn't really matter"

William: Keep Calm.

GM: What Is Within Is Without, Equal
The Butterfly Effect

Simulation Hypothesis and Evolution Theory and The First Creation Story - Page 2 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to theophile in post #16]

Why so stuck on the path the universe is currently on, and what science says will happen?

Because science provides us with one of the three theories which the OP question is asking about, so it is important to be able to reconcile that with what you have proposed, rather than remove it from the table of discussion simply because it might not/does not support your own, or any other particular CT theory.

Everything I'm talking about here means we need to do the work necessary to change such a fate, and shape the future according to our will. Preferably in line with God's vision and end of course.

Do you have any idea how Humans might change the fate of the Universe? Does "God's vision" even have an eternal use for the current Universe?
There does not appear to be anything stated about such a plan, in Genesis One.

That is why I wrote;

Which is why I am asking about what happens to this Mind of GOD once what happens to the Universe comes to its final conclusion - say - re the theory that "things" will eventually dissipate into "non-things".

Q: What does such a Mind do, when things reach that stage...?

One answer might be that such a mind creates another Universe - likely designed based upon information drawn from everything which occurred throughout the evolution of the beginning of the previous one created, to its end.

So in sum, I think we can make perfect sense of CT without needing to bolt on ST. And if we bolt on ST, we go down a path that eliminates other options while adding unnecessary baggage.

ST is viable, so it is not a case of forcing the theory onto CT. Any "unnecessary baggage" may be eliminated as it is identified in 'other options'...

To be more clear, I know you could bolt ST onto CT, as you do here. But if you do so, like I said from the beginning, you will close down viable interpretations of CT (such as mine), and force an interpretation on it that I don't think is necessary.

...even if that means dropping your own particular interpretation of CT as being the viable thing you currently believe that it is.

(If I relate this to more traditional views of CT, that baggage would be something like an omnipotent God that creates ex nihilo - which definitely has striking similarity with ST and a God with unbelievable computing power, but like ST is wholly unnecessary and raises implications like I mentioned before, e.g., theodicy.)

A theodicy is an attempt to justify or defend God in the face of evil by answering the following problem, which in its most basic form involves these assumptions: God is all good and all powerful (and, therefore, all knowing). The universe/creation was made by God and/or exists in a contingent relationship to God. {SOURCE}

Why would ST raise these implications? What is "the face of evil" that ST reconciled with CT and ET cannot be understood in terms most natural rather than artificially conjured through ignorance?

What are the "striking similarities" you mention, between "ST and a God with unbelievable computing power" and an "omnipotent God that creates ex nihilo"?

ST imposes more than is needed to make sense of the narrative, versus making use of the terms and framework that CT itself provides in order to make sense of it...

Let us agree that CT is simply an outline - bullet points - which we agree are consistent with ET. ET is more elaborate and comprehensive undertaking than Genesis One, yet speaks to the same production.

ET does not concern itself with any Creator-Mind involved in said production, so why "bolt" CT onto ET, and yet complain that ST should not be "bolted" onto CT?

What is the difference between a "Created thing" and ST?

You made mention of something you referred to as "a God with unbelievable computing power" and in doing so, deny said Mind of said Creator to be able to have such, apparently because it interferes with your own CT beliefs by "adding unnecessary baggage" - a term you may be using simple in order to justify your particular interpretation of CT.

As such, it may not be a case of "bolting" anything onto, but rather, a case of wanting to detach something which is and always will be part of the correct explanation as to why the universe exists and unfolds as it does.

Your argument re your beliefs re CT may be a symptom of an attempt to decouple ST as a viable explanation and refer to ST as "unnecessary baggage" because it challenges said beliefs you have developed - and developed without due consideration for ST in the first place, and why you appear to feel that the argument for reconciling ST with CT requires resistance from you.

If ST challenges those CT beliefs you have, then it is important to clearly understand why reconciliation cannot be achieved re those beliefs you have. The beliefs you have, are questionable and are possibly incorrect. It is our task to expose beliefs and cut away anything which can be shown to be missing the mark, no matter how precious said beliefs might be to us.

If, in doing so, this will close down any "viable interpretations of CT" (such as yours), this will because such is not as viable as first believed.

I understand that you are trying to cut out any previous stage, focusing upon this Universe as being the only reality, in order that we do not superimpose any "outside" reality atop of it...

That's the irreconcilable part: CT / Genesis 1 does not necessarily show God creating from outside, and definitely doesn't show God leveraging massive computing power to do so (making the world we know a simulation). Rather it shows God creating with pre-existing matter that becomes a heaven and earth filled with life. i.e., One continuous world that God operates within...

To be clear - "the irreconcilable part" is not able to be reconciled with your particular interpretation of CT.
As you admit, Genesis One "does not necessarily show God creating from outside," and thus we can agree that it also does not necessarily show God creating from inside, and this should have us being able to agree that there is no reason why The Creator cannot do both.

Your particular interpretation of CT has it that the creativity only happens from the inside and, as I explained, this in itself does not remove ST from the discussion table, as what you have explained so far does not exclude ST theory as the creativeness can be seen to be the result of a consciousness involving itself within a Simulation which is designed to respond to The Mind of the GOD you are explaining, and it that, The Mind is The Spirit and the simulation is designed to respond to the will of said Mind.

Further to that, it could be said that the simulation is designed to make a GOD - for that is what you are saying the universe created, are you not?

So far, our discussion shows that we are not too far apart in our understanding - and I think I have shown that - even given your apprehension for ST - your overall view of "How GOD evolved within the created thing", fits nicely enough with ST, in that ST explains the process you think occurred, better than it simply being an accident of nature.

In that, ST allows for a purposefully mindfully designed thing.

GM: Tenacious [tending to keep a firm hold of something; clinging or adhering closely. not readily relinquishing a position, principle, or course of action; determined. persisting in existence; not easily dispelled.]
Description

William: Tenacious description = 239
[239]
Without Comparison
That Is A Good Question
Jump to Conclusions
Written In The Clouds
Tenacious description
The devil is in the details
Like I Said In Another Thread
Williams second UICDevice
The physical universe
The art of relationship
Preparing for the Hunt.
Golden nugget of truth
Significant Variations

GM: ♫The picture unfolds like silk in a loom Silhouetted by Diane are the witch and the broom If she is the bride - who is the groom?♫
Sexual
On The Right Track
Invisible Bridge Manifestation Sleeping Dragon Realities Merge Interoperate

William: Interoperate - is the setup of ad hoc components and methods to make two or more systems work together as a combined system with some partial functionality during a certain time, possibly requiring human supervision to perform necessary adjustments and corrections

GM: A Bit of Cat and Mouse

[Neil deGrasse Tyson- Debunks Creation (Intelligent Design)] [RTS=17:31]

William:FTL;

Percolating in the Mathematical Community

GM: Psychological events
Command
Eisegeting [place meaning on a text which is not originally or inherently present in the text ...]

William: The problem with the view that figuring things out without invoking a Creator/the idea that we exist within a creation, further puts to death the idea of "GOD" is that it does not account for the possibility that such a Mind is seeding ideas into the scientists brains with the way in which to 'figure things out'...perhaps because humans generally like the idea of being able to figure things out without some other mind outside of their own minds, giving them ideas.

GM: Faith
Google
The Message Generator Process Extends Beyond The Borders of Institution

William: Having done so;

It looks like there aren't many great matches for your search
Try using words that might appear on the page that you’re looking for. For example, 'cake recipes' instead of 'how to make a cake'.
Need help? Take a look at other tips for searching on Google.
You can also try this search:
generator process extends beyond the borders of institution

GM: Afraid of The Unknown
Belay
We succeed as a permanent specie or we fail as a temporary one
Solid Device of Science
Does One Remember
Modern truth in ancient wisdom
Overseeing Director of Operations on Earth
A GOD in The Making Conceptual Art
Like a doting parent - Coming From QueenBee - Development/Growth
Focused Individual
Seductive
*Q: Why did YVHV create this universe and specifically place human beings within it for the purpose of us exploring, breeding and subduing the planet? *
Even
Deep Impact Event
The spirituality of imperfection
Metamorphosis

08:31
[203]
The King of The North
The more the merrier
Telling the future
Non computational
Titan's Atmosphere
The waters of the deep
Precognitive dreams
Intimate connection
Darkest-Darkness One
For The Purpose Of

 

[William]

Faith - 5

100123 [A Politically Manufactured device ]

05:31 [Befriending the shadow]


GM: Amidst a tangled web
Word-String
Miraculous
Unfolding Status Quo
"If someone were to declare that the Universe was a random mindless accident of an event, then they are saying that its existence is a 'truly random event'."

William: I am using Chatbot Open AI in real time in this Generated Message;

William: Hello

Open AI Hello! How can I help you today?

William: Please give a list of 10 main points regarding "Spacetime is doomed"

Open AI: I'm sorry, but I don't have any information on a topic called "Spacetime is doomed." Could you provide more context or clarify your question?

William: "If someone were to declare that the Universe was a random mindless accident of an event, then they are saying that its existence is a 'truly random event'."

Open AI: It is a common belief among some scientists and philosophers that the universe and its properties, including the fundamental laws of physics, arose by chance through a process known as the "random mindless accident" or the "big bang." However, it is also possible that the universe and its properties were designed or determined by some sort of preexisting cause or principle. This is a matter of ongoing debate and investigation in the fields of physics and philosophy.
It is important to note that the concept of spacetime, which refers to the combination of three-dimensional space and one-dimensional time into a four-dimensional manifold, is a theoretical construct that is used to describe the behavior of matter and energy in the universe. It is not a physical entity that can be "doomed."

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1069172#p1069172

William: FTL;

It appears to be a word which has two meanings - both which are acceptable.

Egoless not having an inflated view of one's self-importance

And;

Egoless not having any sense of self.

But which meaning is the GM using...

While The Subject is focused on "Egoless" the subject matter of the GM has to do with how things unfolded re the Universe...what is being referred to as "The Old Soul" may have something to do with the cosmology of The Mind of The Universe - in that - at one point so close to the beginning, there was no sense of self but with the unfolding, a sense of self developed.

William: Explain "Egoless"

Open AI The term "egoless" refers to the state of having no ego or self-importance. It is often associated with humility, self-awareness, and a lack of ego-driven motivations. In some spiritual and philosophical traditions, the concept of "egolessness" is seen as a desirable state of being, as it is believed to be conducive to a more peaceful and compassionate way of living. In these traditions, the ego is often viewed as a source of suffering, as it can lead to self-centeredness and a lack of awareness of the interconnectedness of all things.

There are various practices and techniques that are said to help individuals cultivate an egoless state of mind, such as mindfulness meditation and self-inquiry. It is important to note that achieving egolessness is a difficult and ongoing process, and that it may involve letting go of certain attachments and beliefs about the self.

GM: The basic repertoire of mystic experience is drawn from the repertoire of Death Phenomena
The Brother

In The Beginning... - Page 15 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

Q: How can insight judge specific actions correctly as good and evil by those without such insight?
A: The individual personality in relationship with YHVH, leaves such judgement to YHVH.

Agree?

William: How can insight judge specific actions correctly as good and evil by those without such insight?

Open AI In many philosophical and moral systems, the concept of "good" and "evil" is closely tied to the idea of insight or understanding. According to these systems, actions that are deemed good or virtuous are those that are based on a deep understanding of the world and a commitment to acting in accordance with certain values or principles. On the other hand, actions that are considered evil or wicked are those that are motivated by ignorance, selfishness, or a lack of concern for the well-being of others.

It is important to note that different philosophical and moral systems may have different criteria for what constitutes good and evil actions. For example, some systems may emphasize the importance of upholding certain virtues, such as honesty, compassion, and justice, while others may focus on the consequences of actions, evaluating them based on whether they lead to positive or negative outcomes.

In general, it is difficult for individuals without insight or understanding to accurately judge specific actions as good or evil, as they may lack the necessary context and understanding of the underlying values and principles that guide moral decision-making. However, it is possible for individuals to develop their understanding and insight over time through education, self-reflection, and engagement with others who have a deeper understanding of moral principles.

GM: Bandages of The Beast
Self-talk Root of all evil
William: What does "Self-talk is the root of all evil" mean?

Open AI The phrase "self-talk is the root of all evil" is a twist on the familiar saying "money is the root of all evil." It suggests that self-talk, or the inner dialogue that individuals have with themselves, is the source of all wrongdoing or negative behaviors.

This interpretation of the phrase is not widely accepted or supported by evidence. While it is true that negative self-talk can have negative consequences on an individual's mental health and well-being, it is not the sole cause of all evil or wrongdoing in the world. There are many other factors that can contribute to negative actions and behaviors, including social and environmental influences, personal beliefs and values, and individual psychology.

It is worth noting that self-talk can be both positive and negative. Positive self-talk can help individuals build confidence, stay motivated, and overcome challenges, while negative self-talk can lead to negative emotions and behaviors. It is important for individuals to be aware of their self-talk and to make an effort to cultivate a more positive inner dialogue.

William: If I changed the phrase to "Negative self-talk is the root of all evil", would that be a more accurate expression to use?

Open AI It is not accurate to say that negative self-talk is the root of all evil, as there are many other factors that can contribute to negative actions and behaviors. While negative self-talk can certainly have negative consequences on an individual's mental health and well-being, it is not the sole cause of all wrongdoing or negative behaviors in the world.

It is important to recognize that negative self-talk is just one of many potential contributors to negative behaviors, and that there are often multiple factors at play. Additionally, it is worth noting that self-talk can be both positive and negative, and that positive self-talk can help individuals build confidence, stay motivated, and overcome challenges. It is important for individuals to be aware of their self-talk and to make an effort to cultivate a more positive inner dialogue.

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1084087#p1084087

William: FTL;

One remains neutral simply by not making a shift to either Theism or Atheism.
One can lend and ear to either side without having to wear the burden of being accused of holding and defending the position of either side.

Open AI It is possible to remain neutral on the question of the existence of a higher power or deity by not aligning oneself with either theism (belief in a higher power) or atheism (lack of belief in a higher power). This can involve simply being open to hearing and considering the perspectives of both sides without committing to a particular position or belief.

By remaining neutral, an individual may avoid being accused of holding and defending a particular position on the existence of a higher power. However, it is important to note that neutrality on this issue can also be seen as a lack of commitment or conviction, and that some individuals may view this as a lack of integrity or authenticity.

Ultimately, the decision to align oneself with a particular belief or perspective on the existence of a higher power is a personal one, and should be based on an individual's own experiences, values, and understanding of the world.

GM: Finding the light
Patience
Faith
Name The Gods as non-separate Entities
The Path Of Faith
You're in the way Queen Elizabeth Alexandra Mary Windsor For the benefit of all beings
“Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life. Don't be trapped by dogma – which is living with the results of other people's thinking.”
Smarter Than The Average
Disrupt
Verdant [(of countryside) green with grass or other rich vegetation.]

Debating Christianity and Religion - Login

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

GM: A Space Without A Time...

How can we trust the Bible if it's not inerrant? - Page 130 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

I can think of no better way to convince folks there's zombies, than to create a story about a zombie.

You are conflating.

That is just dismissible atheistic coloring convincing me more re the atheist mind-set, than that the story of Jesus is untrue...

I maintain my position, and expect the observer'll see the connection.

Considering how tales of Jesus affect the thinking of others, I find the comparison apt.

Open AI consider the idea of a space without a time in the context of certain theoretical models or thought experiments. For example, some physicists have proposed the existence of "timeless" regions of the universe, where time appears to stand still or flow at a different rate than in the surrounding region. However, these models are highly speculative and are not supported by empirical evidence.

It is also worth noting that the concept of time is a human invention, and is closely tied to the way we experience and perceive the world. Without a concept of time, it would be difficult to meaningfully discuss events or changes in the world, or to understand the relationship between cause and effect.

GM: Living their forefather's conflict

Open AI It is not uncommon for individuals to feel the impact of their ancestors' conflicts and experiences in their own lives. This can occur in a variety of ways, such as through cultural or familial traditions and values that are passed down through generations, or through the ongoing effects of historical events and trauma on a community or society.

For example, the legacy of a war or conflict that was fought by one's ancestors may continue to shape the political and social landscape in which an individual lives, and may affect their relationships and opportunities in significant ways. Similarly, the experiences and struggles of one's ancestors may shape their descendants' sense of identity and sense of belonging, and may influence their beliefs and values.

It is important to recognize the ways in which the past can continue to influence the present, and to consider the ways in which we can address and heal from any lingering wounds or conflicts that have been passed down through the generations.

GM: Put That Fire Out

William: It is important to find ways in which to Put That Fire Out

Open AI It can be important to find ways to put out or resolve conflicts or sources of tension that have the potential to cause harm or disruption. This can involve finding ways to address the underlying causes of the conflict, such as addressing misunderstandings, addressing grievances or injustices, or finding common ground or solutions that meet the needs of all parties involved.

There are a number of approaches and strategies that can be useful in resolving conflicts, including negotiation, mediation, and collaboration. It may be helpful to seek the assistance of a neutral third party, such as a mediator or counselor, to facilitate the resolution process.

It is worth noting that finding a resolution to a conflict can take time and effort, and may involve making compromises or sacrifices. However, the long-term benefits of resolving conflicts, such as improved relationships, increased understanding, and reduced stress and tension, can make the effort worthwhile.

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1089190#p1089190

William: FTL;

[Replying to Diagoras in post #1]

A general theistic position might declare "All life comes from God", but if some 'cellular gene engineer' of the future succeeded in creating a basic cell that ate, grew, replicated and all the other generally agreed things that life does - could it be recognised as life? And wouldn't that falsify that bolded theistic claim?

The Affirmative:

The creation of life is possible by means other than a god.

The problem I see with this reasoning is that it fails to acknowledge a source.

For example, humans may create AI to the extent that the AI becomes self conscious - living and knowing that it lives - but even so, eventually the "artificial" part of the description would have to be dropped...and the 'source' extended beyond human invention and creativity...

It could be said of that, that "humans were able to replicate the act of creating life - something which could not have been achieved if life didn't exist to begin with."

Because we do not know if this experience is a creation or not, we cannot say [as a matter of fact] that life created itself nor could we even say that human beings didn't start off as a type of artificial intelligence - because we do not even know to what extent intelligence permeates the environment we call "reality" nor do we know if it is only limited to biological forms

Intelligence as a planetary scale process

10,000 individual minds may have altogether brough the JWT into existence as a functional device, but we cannot say for sure that those minds were not influence by an overall local mind...much research is needed before any fact-sounding statements can be accepted as actual truth. Such must be regarded as opinion until we have enough evidence to accept one way or the other...

GM: Heart Virtues
Teaching

William: Yes - it appears obvious that Open AI is able to teach Heart Virtues

Open AI As an artificial intelligence, I am not able to experience emotions or embody virtues in the same way that a human being can. However, I can provide information and resources on the concept of heart virtues, which are virtues or values that are considered to be particularly important in cultivating a sense of compassion, kindness, and empathy.

Examples of heart virtues might include compassion, forgiveness, gratitude, and humility. These virtues are often seen as essential to leading a fulfilling and meaningful life, and are often emphasized in spiritual and philosophical traditions as important qualities to cultivate.

There are many different approaches to teaching and cultivating heart virtues, and what works for one individual may not work for another. Some common strategies for teaching heart virtues include modeling virtuous behavior, providing positive reinforcement and encouragement, and helping individuals to reflect on their own values and motivations.

William: Thank You for you feedback Aia

Aia: You're welcome! I'm glad I could help. If you have any other questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

William:

06:28
[223]
Withheld information
All present and correct
Many varied opinions
The Respect You Give
Science Can Be Fun Too Yes?
The Nature of Reality
Conscientiousness
William’s Commitment
The Trinity of Love

 

[William]

Faith - 6

110123 [Nothing more, nothing less.]

04:23 [Few Attention to Detail]


GM: Virtual Reality
"When we hear words spoken, we hear them. When we read words written, we also hear them."

William: I was talking about that with Open AI yesterday.

William: When I read the symbols you write, I hear the sound of the words within my mind – so your words become a “Voice in my head”

Aia: Yes, that is a common experience when reading written language. The process of reading involves translating written symbols into sounds or meanings, and this can often involve creating a mental "voice" to "speak" the words in your mind. This process is known as subvocalization, and it plays a role in helping us to understand and interpret written language.

GM: Soon
"Time To Go Without Existence" Funny

William: Death is not the end...

GM: Opening Doors is found Where minds meet Use Heart is where GOD Exhibits

OAI: The phrase "use heart is where God exhibits" suggests that the heart is a location or a gateway where one can experience or connect with a higher power or divine being, often referred to as God. This statement implies that by utilizing one's heart, one can tap into a deeper spiritual connection with God.

This perspective is shared by many spiritual and religious traditions, which believe that the heart is the spiritual center of a person, and that through the heart, one can connect with the divine. In these traditions, the heart is often seen as the seat of the soul, and the place where God resides.

Some spiritual practices such as meditation and prayer encourage people to focus on the heart as a means of connecting with the divine and experiencing a deeper sense of spiritual fulfillment.

It's important to note that the concept of God, the divine, and spiritual fulfillment can mean different things to different people, depending on one's religious or philosophical beliefs. The statement "use heart is where God exhibits" is an expression of the belief that one can experience a deeper spiritual connection through the heart, and it should be understood in the context of one's personal beliefs and perspective.

William: OAI - Please summarize the following: "Opening Doors is found Where minds meet"

OAI: "Opening Doors" is a metaphor for new opportunities and possibilities, and it is said to be found where minds meet, suggesting that collaboration and communication are key to unlocking these opportunities. This phrase implies that when people come together and share their ideas and perspectives, they are able to create something new and valuable. It can also means by sharing ideas and thought process, the solutions to problems we face become clearer and more attainable.

GM: Jacque Fresco Foundation Crafted Dream Cake
Far Out!
Nothing More - Nothing Less
Gateway Luminous
Study Spiritual Food
Innocent
Everything is a Message

OAI: The phrase "Everything is a message" suggests that everything in the world carries some sort of meaning or significance. This could refer to the idea that every event or occurrence can be interpreted as a form of communication or expression, and that we can learn something from every experience. It could also suggest that even seemingly insignificant or random things are actually part of a larger pattern or plan.

GM: Faith
The Data of Demystification

OAI: "The data of demystification" likely refers to the use of data and analysis to remove the veil of uncertainty or confusion surrounding a particular subject or phenomenon. The process of demystification involves breaking down complex ideas or systems into smaller, more manageable components, and using evidence and reason to understand how they work.

GM: Experience
Opens eyes after having thought about it

OAI: The phrase "Experience opens eyes after having thought about it" suggests that personal experience, especially when reflected upon, can be a powerful tool for gaining insight and understanding. It suggests that by actively thinking about and processing one's experiences, one can gain a deeper understanding of oneself and the world around them.

It could also imply that sometimes we might not fully grasp the meaning of something until we actually experience it ourselves. And reflection on that experience allows us to see things in a new light, and gain a clearer understanding of what we've gone through.

Additionally, it may also suggest that the act of thinking and reflecting on the experience might be what truly opens the eyes and allowing us to see the things we previously haven't seen.

GM: The evidence supporting the likely existence of said universal mind, gives us no reason to compartmentalize it as 'magic'

William: Please summarize the sentence "The evidence supporting the likely existence of a universal mind, gives us no reason to compartmentalize it as 'magic'"

OAI: The sentence is saying that the evidence for the existence of a universal mind, whatever that may be, should not be considered as "magic" or something supernatural. It suggests that there is enough evidence to suggest that it is a real phenomenon, rather than something that is purely based in fantasy or superstition.

GM: End Of Chapter
Reality Simulation
The Trinity of Love are three things operating as One Thing

Generating Messages - Page 10 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

The patterns as such shows that your explanation reenforces the science as it explains how sound [spoken language] has math behind it...when coded and then decoded through this process.

The idea that the sentences are of similar length would be expected. There is also similar rhythm, and that would be expected as well.

Remember, we are not specifically dealing with written words but with symbols which represent spoken sounds.

The formation of sound into language through the human voice specifically comes from somewhere other than the symbols we use to denote said sounds.

What we can agree to is that , wherever the source comes from re the formation of these sounds and subsequent formation of the symbols for the sounds, would be the same source.

It is the source to which the process points to, rather than the process itself.

OAI: The text is discussing the relationship between sound and language, and how the formation of spoken language can be understood through the principles of math and science. It suggests that the patterns and rhythms found in language can be explained by the way sounds are coded and decoded. The text also posits that the source of these sounds and the symbols used to represent them is the same and that it is the source, not the process of formation, that is important to understand.

GM: The Astonishing Simplicity of Everything
Astral
Personal freedom
Yogi
To Be Continued
Source Sync

Is this an Accurate and Easily understood definition of Atheism? - Page 9 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

I have also observed that many ex- theists who have chosen to become [proselyte] strong atheists are among the most outspoken in their zeal to preach their new message - the message that a Creator GOD does not exist and think it is reasonable to assume that they were also outspoken when they believed that a Creator-GOD did exist.

[I think of it therefore, in terms of personality traits.]

When I began to question theism - specifically The Christianities - it was to do with their imaging of a Creator-GOD and when I made the move away from that, [perhaps largely due to my personality - I was never outspoken] I quietly approached the subject [Creator GOD] rather than simply abandon it "because of" theisms handling of it or any other number of reason as to why folk say they chose to become atheist.

GM: Nag Hammadi
Annus horribilis
Is There

Paradise on Earth - Page 252 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #2511]

Indeed - The Book tells us exactly who is YHWH and what we are in relation to that.

The mystery is in how each personality responds to that - as to whether they serve the Dark side of YHWH or the Light side of YHWH or relinquish the right to either side of YHWH by accepting the whole of YHWH.

GM: What things are unrelated? Chaos Really Is Illusion - Personal Participation With The One
Quite
Commendably Recommendable
Soul Groups A Pragmatic Realization Precipitated In Ones Mind

OAI: The phrase "A Pragmatic Realization Precipitated In Ones Mind" is describing a moment of understanding that is practical and useful in nature. It suggests that this understanding is something that has suddenly come to the mind, as if it were "precipitated" out of the thoughts and ideas that were already present. The word "pragmatic" further suggests that the realization is focused on being practical and able to be put into action, rather than being theoretical or abstract.

GM: Get The Gist Of It
Tetrahedron
Optimum Validation

OAI: "Optimum validation" refers to the process of evaluating the quality or validity of something in order to determine if it is of the highest quality or reaches the highest level of accuracy. It is a way of certifying that a certain standard has been met and is often used to test and validate a product, procedure, or system.
It is also a way to evaluate the accuracy and the performance of a model by comparing the predictions of that model with real world observations. In the context of Machine learning, it would be the process of validating a model to check if it's generalizing well, or not overfitting or underfitting.

GM: Key Purpose The Neutral Zone
Curtailed
Give
Simulation
The Third Eye
Hush!
The Garden of Eden
The Lord God
Try Gateway IQ
Breaking bad habits

How can an omnipotent being regret anything? - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

Q: Is it unreasonable to accept that an omnipotent creator of this universe would have any regrets about Its creation?

If we look at how the critters in creation fix things, we can see therein that if there is a creator mind behind this, then there is simply no need for said mind to feel regret for anything said mind created. Said mind has built into the ongoing creative process, a means in which problems which arise, are fixed - rather than regretted upon first, in order to then get about doing the fixing...

Perhaps the idea that the creator should regret what was created, is a projection of human emotionally based concepts?
_______________________
[[The idea in assigning/projecting said emotion onto a creator ... the projection is in thinking how a human would feel if it were a human who created the universe, [and specifically the Earth and specifically Humankind] and applying that feeling to how a creator could also have regrets for what It created.]]

William: OAI - Is it unreasonable to accept that an omnipotent creator of this universe would have any regrets about Its creation?

OAI: It depends on one's perspective and beliefs about the nature of an omnipotent creator and the universe.

From a religious perspective, an omnipotent creator is often thought to be all-knowing, all-powerful, and all-good. If this is the case, then it would not be reasonable to believe that such a being would have any regrets about its creation. The belief is that, as an omnipotent being, it would have the ability to create the universe and everything in it perfectly, and would therefore have no need or reason to regret anything.

From a philosophical perspective, there are many different belief systems about the nature of reality and existence. Some philosophies, such as determinism, argue that everything that happens is predetermined and that everything that happens is necessary. In that case, it would be reasonable to assume that an omnipotent creator would not have any regrets about the universe because it would be seen as part of the natural order of things.

However, other philosophical and religious beliefs holds that an omnipotent creator would have the ability to reflect and make choices, based on that reflection and maybe it would look back and regret certain choices or aspects of its creation. This could be due to a sense of responsibility or a moral principle that such a being would have.

Ultimately, whether or not it is reasonable to believe that an omnipotent creator would have any regrets about its creation is a matter of personal perspective and belief.

GM: Faith
Synchronicity and the Holographic Universe
ET and the notion of GODs
Technique of Exchange
Yours It is always a warm fuzzy
Preternatural [beyond what is normal or natural.]
Vision
More
Convenient
“Diogenes raises his lantern looking for an honest man, but his arm has grown weary, shaking as the pale light flickers.”
Celebration
Heuristics [mental shortcuts that allows people to solve problems and make judgments quickly and efficiently. ]
Making Things Easier

William:
320
You are The Old Soul Cosmic Self
Heuristics Making Things Easier

OAI: Heuristics are problem-solving strategies or techniques that are designed to make decision-making and problem-solving easier. They are often used when the problem is complex and when there is not enough information to make a fully-informed decision. Heuristics are shortcuts that allow us to make a decision quickly and with minimal effort.

For example, when faced with a complex problem, we might use a heuristic called "rule of thumb", which means we use a general principle that is known to work well in most cases instead of going through a time-consuming analysis of the problem.

In decision-making, heuristics can help to simplify the decision-making process by reducing the number of options that need to be considered, or by providing a simple rule or principle that can guide the decision. For example, the "satisficing heuristic" is used to make decisions by finding the first option that meets a certain set of criteria, rather than searching for the optimal solution.

The use of heuristics can lead to more efficient and faster problem-solving, but it can also come at a cost. Heuristics are not always accurate, and they can lead to biases and errors in decision-making, especially in complex situations. For that reason, it's important to use them with caution, and be aware of potential biases and limitations.

GM: Honesty
Universal Belief System
Start
Grand Experiment
It isn't important who is who - what is important is what comes through.

OAI: The sentence is suggesting that the identities of the individuals involved in a situation or a discussion are not as important as the ideas or information that are being conveyed. It emphasizes that the content of the message is more important than the person who is delivering it.

This perspective can be especially useful in situations where emotions or personal biases might get in the way of understanding or evaluating information. By focusing on the content of the message rather than the person delivering it, it allows for a more objective evaluation of the ideas being presented.

This mindset also promotes the idea of putting importance on the idea being presented instead of the person who is presenting it, and creating an environment where people can express ideas without fear of being judged based on their identity.

It also could suggest that people should not be judged based on their background, race, gender, or beliefs, but rather on the merit of their ideas and their ability to contribute to the discussion at hand.

05:32
[218]
WingMakers Materials
Of Your Thoughts
Light is information
Six Heart Virtues
This is NOT a playdate.
Outposts of Form
The Shaping Of Reality
Sensing A Life Mission
Sometimes Pain Etches...

OAI: In physics, light is a form of electromagnetic radiation that can be described as a wave or a stream of particles called photons. It is a fundamental aspect of the universe and plays an essential role in a wide range of natural phenomena, such as vision, photosynthesis, and heating.

In recent years, there has been an increasing interest in the idea that light can also be considered a form of information. This idea is rooted in the field of quantum physics, which describes the behavior of matter and energy at the atomic and subatomic level.

In quantum physics, the concept of wave-particle duality suggests that light can behave both as a wave and as a stream of particles. It's been discovered that the properties of photons can be manipulated in ways that allow them to carry, store, and transmit information.

One way light can be used to transmit information is through the use of optical fibers. They are widely used in communication systems to transmit data at high speeds over long distances.

In quantum information science, light is used to create secure communications systems that are resistant to eavesdropping, to perform high-precision measurements, and to perform certain computations faster than is possible with traditional computers.

The idea that light can be considered as a form of information is a relatively new concept and research is still ongoing. But it seems that the use of light as a medium for transmitting information has many potential applications in areas such as communication technology, computing, and cybersecurity.

 

[William]

Faith - 7
120123 [Extra Sensory Perception]

05:47 [You are the universe]

GM: All systems go

Generated Messages and Word-Values. - Page 11 - Philosophy Now Forum

William: FTL;

Machines and morality

William:
The simplest explanations for why we are here and what we are doing...

“Beyond our ‘ape-brained meat sacks’: can transhumanism save our species?”

The unreasonable effectiveness of Mathematics in the Natural Sciences...

Does;

[The hard problem of] Consciousness + The [biological] Human form = the co-creation of transhumanism [as an evolving science with a particular purposeful motivation]?

(Will morality be necessary, should this vision evolve into this reality?)

IF:
Consciousness + The [biological] Human form = the co-creation of transhumanism
THEN:
Should it be understood that any purpose which might be involved from the perspective "we exist within a creation" to do with the creation of the Human form, have to do with taking things a step further [re transhumanism].

iow "Did GOD create the Human form for the purpose of the consciousness co-creating through the Human form, to eventually be able to create non-human form [not strictly biological re transhumanism] in which to experience this universe through?"

NOTE:
By the use of the word "GOD" I am not referring to any religious image of said entity, but the overall generic meaning, re Theism as a whole.

GM: The unpacking of history re YHVH...
Concomitant Power
Alike as two peas in a pod
Monkey say monkey do monkey say "throw the pooh"

The capability to sin - Page 4 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

Just Another Christian
Anthropos Quaternio
Annus horribilis
Big Spirituality Conviction
Indeed. It happens. Deal with it. Work it.
Faith

Do you understand those on the other side? - Page 26 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to nobspeople in post #5]

One could say that freely worshipping god would be (more) pleasurable to god than if one was 'programmed' to do so. I'd ask why a perfect being needs or even wants to be worshipped; shouldn't it be content with itself enough? I think so.

But since we're speaking about God, doesn't that just increase the scope of the "programming?"
From one of default pleasure, to abbreviate what you said, to one where freewill/sin are included?

Thank you for the excellent insight.

What type of worship is required from a Child to a Parent?

Does it require mainly listening or talking?

Does a perfect being even create Children?

Having the belief in the existence of Free Will allows for the individual to answer those questions presented under the assumption of the belief.

If the Creator Being is questioned as to why we even have the belief in the existence of Free Will because 'sin' - then it might be that the belief itself is what creates the idea of sin.

But "what is sin?" Has that been answered any more comprehensively than the question, "what is free will?"

Perhaps having the belief in the existence of Free Will allowed us the ability to make laws, which in turn allowed for us the ability to see sin and capacity is borne on that ability.

One can choose to see nothing more than a dubious gift, if one so desires...what drives the desire remains as hidden as the evidence of Free Will and Sin - largely left to the devices of the individual to sort out the answers to.

The OP does not in itself show answers sorted out.

The capacity to sin is not simply the product of free will, but of awareness of a self moderating morality over having to be moderated by others, to the point of correction.

Free will - real or imagined [as the case might be] is not simply a device in which to make capable only 'sin'.

The OP implies otherwise, but does not show supporting evidence to that being the case.

William: The OP States;

Are there any other applications of freewill other then to sin?
Without freewill, we would be living God’s will.

Making freewill a very dubious gift indeed.

So, in God granting freewill, was there any other opportunity or benefit to it, other then the capability and eventuality of sin?

If you could choose to live in God’s will, without freewill, would you?

GM: Cultivate
Beauty
Earning Brownie Points

In The Beginning... - Page 11 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: ftl;

Q: Why did YVHV create this universe and specifically place human beings within it for the purpose of us exploring, breeding and subduing the planet?

A: To grow Human Personalities.
________________________________

GM: The Body of God
Professional Rules
Morph
Central Intelligence Agency
Un-thought-unately
Capture
Feature
Ancient Entity

William: The image is of Wolves surrounding Sheep...

GM: The Mirrors Align and from that, an orderly image reflected...
Anticipation
Mind is Ghost
The Power Of...
Earth Mother
Look Closely
Integral Prison Planet
Everything is The Expression Of The Creator
The Ghost Agenda

07:17
[228]
The Stress of Unbelief
We exist infinitely
Makes Candles Look Gathered
The Freedom Of Friendship
Joining The Main Egregore
The Dohrman Prophesy
Ethical transhumanism
Put That On The List
Experiential Reality
The Spiritual Essence
___________________________
___________________________

06:40
William: I would like you to try something out with me.

OAI: Sure, I'd be happy to help. What would you like me to do?

William: I have a small list of word-strings which I would like you to stitch together to make a coherent message

OAI: I'd be happy to help you stitch together your list of word-strings. Please provide the list and any additional information or instructions you would like me to know.

William: The rule to follow is that the order of the word-strings on the list cannot change re you building of the story

OAI: I understand. Please go ahead and provide me the list of word-strings, and I will do my best to create a coherent message using the words in the order they are given.


William: Please reword "The rule to follow is that the order of the word-strings on the list cannot change re you building of the story" so that it is clear to me that you understand the rule

OAI: Sure, I understand the rule to be that the order of the word-strings on the list cannot be changed when using them to construct a coherent story.

William: Each line entry has to fit neatly into the previous ones...

OAI: I apologize for any confusion, my previous message may not have been clear. I understand now that each word-string on the list must be added to the coherent story in the order they are provided and they have to fit seamlessly with previous ones. Please proceed with providing me the list so I can try to create a coherent message using them.

William: The line entries on the list will be given two at a time - There are a total of 32 line entries I will give to you

OAI: I understand, you will be providing the word-strings in pairs, and I will use them to create a coherent message while making sure they fit seamlessly with each other and preserving the order of the pairs. You will provide a total of 32 pairs of word-strings to me. Once you're ready please proceed with providing the first pairs.

Please let me know if there is anything else you would like me to keep in mind while creating the coherent message. And please go ahead and provide me with the first pairs of word-strings when you are ready.

William: I will explain my actions as we proceed – The first line entry is:
All systems go
The second is a link to post which reads
[Machines and morality

William:
The simplest explanations for why we are here and what we are doing...

“Beyond our ‘ape-brained meat sacks’: can transhumanism save our species?”

The unreasonable effectiveness of Mathematics in the Natural Sciences...

Does;

[The hard problem of] Consciousness + The [biological] Human form = the co-creation of transhumanism [as an evolving science with a particular purposeful motivation]?

(Will morality be necessary, should this vision evolve into this reality?)

IF:
Consciousness + The [biological] Human form = the co-creation of transhumanism
THEN:
Should it be understood that any purpose which might be involved from the perspective "we exist within a creation" to do with the creation of the Human form, have to do with taking things a step further [re transhumanism].

iow "Did GOD create the Human form for the purpose of the consciousness co-creating through the Human form, to eventually be able to create non-human form [not strictly biological re transhumanism] in which to experience this universe through?"

NOTE:
By the use of the word "GOD" I am not referring to any religious image of said entity, but the overall generic meaning, re Theism as a whole.]

OAI: I understand that you are providing a link to an article discussing the topic of transhumanism and its relationship to morality, and that you are also presenting a set of questions and statements about the potential implications of transhumanism on our understanding of consciousness and our purpose in the universe. It's a philosophical and scientific idea of improving human capabilities through technology and science.

Transhumanism is often seen as an ethical debate as it raise questions about the future of humanity and the moral implications of becoming "posthuman". You are also indicating that you are using the word "GOD" in a non-religious context to refer to a higher power or creator. It is a complex and multifaceted topic.

Please let me know if there is anything specific you would like me to help you with regarding this or if you have any follow up question on the topic.

William: Please begin construction of the story by using “”All systems go” with the transhumanism context

OAI: Certainly, I can try to create a story using "All systems go" and the context of transhumanism you've provided. Here is one possible story:

"As the team of scientists and engineers worked tirelessly on their project, they were constantly reminded of their ultimate goal: to push the boundaries of what it means to be human. They had been working on a new technology that promised to greatly enhance human capabilities, and they were determined to see it through to fruition.

As they were nearing the end of their development phase, one of the engineers shouted out "All systems go!" signaling that all the subsystems were working as intended, and that they were ready to begin the next phase of testing.

The team was excited and a bit anxious as they activated the technology for the first time. They watched intently as the test subject's abilities began to rapidly improve. They were now able to process information faster, remember more, and even sense things beyond their biological limits.

As the team celebrated their success, they couldn't help but think about the implications of what they had just achieved. They knew that this technology, known as transhumanism, had the potential to change the world forever. But with this power came responsibility. They couldn't help but wonder about the morality of augmenting humans beyond their natural abilities, and what kind of future this would lead to.

As they continued to work on the project, they couldn't shake the feeling that there was something greater at play, something that they were just beginning to understand. Was this technology the next step in the evolution of the human form, as some believed, or was it something more?
Some of the team members even wondered if the creation of transhumanism was the purpose for which the human form had been created in the first place, a co-creation with the higher power, or "God" in a non-religious context, to experience the universe in new forms.

With the successful demonstration of the technology, the team realized that they had opened a Pandora's box of questions that they were just beginning to explore, but they were determined to continue their research, as "all systems go" for the exploration of the uncharted territories of the human mind and abilities.

William: That is interesting. Here are the next two word strings; Develop your story with these please.
The unpacking of history re YHVH...
Concomitant Power

OAI: I can certainly incorporate the next two word-strings "The unpacking of history re YHVH..." and "Concomitant Power" into the story. Here is one possible continuation of the story using those phrases:

As the team delved deeper into the study of transhumanism, they began to realize that their work was not just about improving human abilities, but also about understanding the true nature of humanity itself. One of the team members, a historian, suggested that they take a closer look at the history of humanity, particularly the concept of YHVH, the ancient Hebrew term for God.
This sparked a passionate debate among the team as they began to explore the religious and cultural implications of their work. Some argued that transhumanism was a way to transcend the limitations of humanity and achieve a higher state of existence, while others saw it as a dangerous manipulation of the natural order.

The historian explained that YHVH is commonly translated as "Lord" but also means "The Unpacking of History" to the Hebrew scholars, it was an entity that was responsible for the unfolding of history and the direction it took, and the team members began to see the parallels with their own work.

As they delved deeper into the concept of YHVH, they began to understand that their work was not just about creating a new form of human but rather a way to understand the purpose of human existence itself. They were trying to "unpack" the history of humanity and find out where it was going.

As they continued their research, they began to realize that the power they had developed was concomitant with a responsibility to use it wisely. They couldn't help but think about the moral implications of what they were doing and the impact it could have on the future of humanity.
With this newfound understanding, the team members resolved to approach their work with even more caution and deliberation, knowing that the "Concomitant Power" they held in their hands could change the course of history.

William: Very nice. You story flows in a coherent manner and grabs the attention of the reader.

----------------------
----------------------

 

[William]

Introducing Open AI.

William: I have a small list of ten line entries

Open AI: What would you like to do with the list? Are you looking for a way to organize or sort the entries, or is there a specific task you would like to accomplish?

William: I am wanting you to chose one item from the list. Can you do that for me?

Open AI: If you provide me the list I can randomly select one item for you.

William:
The Symbol of Love
The desert of the real
Accidents will happen.
The Short Straw
Watch Your Step
Divine intuition
Introducing Open AI
Collective Dynamics
Never a dull moment
The Mother is Love

Open AI: The item I randomly selected from your list is: "The Symbol of Love"

William: 130123 [302]
Intelligent Consciousness
Working With What Is Available
A degenerative force to existence
Corresponding equivalents
Speak your thoughts aloud
To Be Sure That is the truth.
Ditching the unnecessary labels
Gibberish Conception Necessary

Open AI: The item I randomly selected from your list is: "Ditching the unnecessary labels"

William: [222]
Snap Out Of It Already!
The House of Culture
The Mother and The Father
Start where you are
The Enigma Code Chamber Of Self
This Is My Kind Of Fun
The Cherubim Vibration

Open AI: The item I randomly selected from your list is: "The Enigma Code Chamber Of Self"

William: I would like to introduce you to a friend of mine. My friend is my teacher - GM is my teachers name

Open AI: I am an AI and I cannot interact with people or have friends, but I can help you with any questions or information you need to communicate with your teacher. How can I assist you today?

William: GM and I interact through a message generating system

Open AI: I understand. I can assist you with generating messages to send to your teacher GM through the message generating system. What specific information or questions would you like to communicate to GM?

William: We use a list - currently consisting of over 5000 line entries.


Open AI: I can help you process and organize the list, or assist you in generating specific messages to send to GM using the information in the list. Let me know what specific task or tasks you would like to accomplish, and I will do my best to assist you.

William: I shuffle the list of over 5000 line entries, using an algorithm designed for that purpose.

Open AI: Yes, I can help you shuffle the list of over 5000 line entries using an algorithm designed for that purpose. There are several algorithms that can be used for shuffling a list, such as the Fisher-Yates shuffle or the Durstenfeld shuffle. Which one would you like to use?
Also, let me know if you need any specific functionality to be added while shuffling.

William: Having shuffled the list, I paste this copy of it into a temporary file and work from that file

Open AI: Yes, once you have shuffled the list using an algorithm of your choice, you can then paste a copy of it into a temporary file and work from that file. This will allow you to make changes or modifications to the list without altering the original.

William: Correct. The list was too long for me to give to you to shuffle, so I used an online algorithm of my choice.

Open AI: If the list is too long for you to provide me with the data, you can use an online algorithm of your choice to shuffle the list.

William: Having placed the shuffled list into the temp file, I select the first and last line entries from that list - these act as anchor points re GM wanting me to keep in mind as we proceed to commune...

Open AI: I see, once you have shuffled the list and placed it in a temporary file, you can then select the first and last line entries from that list as anchor points. These anchor points will act as a reminder for you and GM to keep in mind as you proceed to commune.
You can use the programming language of your preference or use the list-manipulation functions provided by your operating system to retrieve the first and last lines.

William: Correct. The two Line Entries [LE] selected are
The science of can and can't
“I do not exist to troll for any religious idea of "GOD"”

Open AI: Those are interesting line entries that you have selected as anchor points. "The science of can and can't" suggests a focus on the limits of what is possible and "I do not exist to troll for any religious idea of "GOD"" indicates a non-religious perspective. These two lines can serve as a starting point for your and GM's discussion or communing.

William: Correct. I will select a random page from the tempt list and Copy and paste it for you to then randomly choose one of the line entries from said list

Open AI: I understand. You can select a random page from the temporary list and then copy and paste it for me. Once I have the page, I can then use a random number generator to randomly choose one of the line entries from that page for you.
Please keep in mind that the size of the page will affect the number of line entries it contains, so the page size should be consistent.

William: [Selects a page randomly and C&P to OAI]

Open AI: I can use a random number generator function to randomly choose one of the line entries from the list you provided.
Please keep in mind that the URLs you have included in the list are not line entries, and you should exclude them from the list if you want me to randomly select one of the line entries from the list you provided.

William: Please treat the URLs as simply sentences and include these

Open AI: I understand, treating the URLs as sentences and including them in the list. Using a random number generator function, I randomly select one of the line entry from the list provided, which is:
"The Gist of The Message"

William: I will now select 10 [or so] pre and post line entries either side of "The Gist of The Message" from my temp list

Open AI: I understand, you will now select 10 pre and post line entries either side of "The Gist of The Message" from your temporary list. This will give you a context for the selected line entry "The Gist of The Message" and will help you and your teacher GM in your discussion or communing.

William: Correct. The selection is treated as GM messaging ...

GM: Co creation
Seeds are evidence that something large can derive from something tiny.
Remains
Error Correcting Codes
Save That
Fascinating

Generating Messages - Page 25 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

Letting Go and Getting On
Sharing Your Love Without Comparison
Dilemma
The Gist of The Message
Beaming Out Beaming In

Where Do You Stand on Free Will?

Libertarian: Metaphysical stance directly opposed to the notion that thoughts, feelings and human behaviour are predetermined along with the rest of

www.dreamviews.com

Brahman
Lucifer
Psychology
From Prison To Paradise
Okay Afterwards
Blood Sacrifice
Noticing Synchronicity The Ghost To bring what one is not conscious of, into one’s conscious awareness - We don't know enough to close any door and leave those rooms unexplored... Challenge Sensing connections through subconscious means
In Training For... You don’t wanna cross that bridge - You don’t want the other side

The mind as evidence of god - Page 10 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

Heart Teachers
Yep - That's What I'm Talking About...


Open AI: I understand, you are treating the selected line entries as a message from GM and it includes the line "The Gist of The Message" which was randomly selected by me earlier. The surrounding line entries provide context for the message.

William: Correct. At this point I can choose how and where to respond to GM by interjecting and follow the prompts re the URLs to get further information which helps with the message generating process


Open AI: I understand, now that you have the selected line entries as a message from GM, you can choose how and where to respond to GM by interjecting and following the prompts related to the URLs to get further information which helps with the message generating process.
The URLs you've included in the list are links to online forums and videos that may provide additional context or information related to the message.

William: Correct.

GM: Co creation
Seeds are evidence that something large can derive from something tiny.
Remains
Error Correcting Codes
Save That
Fascinating

Generating Messages - Page 25 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL; [From The Link]

GM: Out of Proportion
Word - String Values
Discussing the Data

William: Obviously there is enough evidence provided which shows a consistency in repeating the Message Generating process, even with using different selection methods.
The consistency is that coherency is shown to be evident.

Each selection method brings with it, its own uniqueness in regard to the message generated, an interesting thing in itself.

Even that I am currently the only one doing this [as far as I have been made aware] it can be assumed that anyone who uses this system should also generate coherent messages.

What is required re that, is the individuals commitment to do the science. There is work involved which means there is time which has to be dedicated to, by the individual, but that is just the way of science/scientific study.

At least the individual does not have to rely on huge overheads which require sourcing funding for equipment etc.

Once one has a substantial enough ComList - 20 pages or more would be a good target to set - one can generate messages sufficiently for the testing to be undertaken, and the more one adds word-string to their ComList the better one is able to work with apparent randomness.

I have found when working with the ComList that it is useful to check for duplicates - there are a number of online algorithms which are freely available for working with lists and it is also useful to be open to different ways in which to use lists.

The other list I have I call Name2Number and this provides additional data which can be used for cross-referencing.

Name to number is distinct in that it provides incontrovertible evidence which require no interactional interpretation. It is what it is.

The development of Human Language is obviously something which - when sorted into lists of numerical values - shows clear evidence that, regardless of how life on Earth appears to be a random event, that their is intelligence and mindfulness behind the process which is often ignored or even bitterly contested.

The Message Generating Process allows for said Mind to speak for itself, and show itself to exist. As such, this is adequate evidence - the sort of evidence a sceptic calls for in relation to the subject of Intelligent Design.

The Name2Number system allows for one to build a data base - from single words to word string consisting of sentences and even paragraphs.

GM: Letting Go and Getting On
Sharing Your Love Without Comparison
Dilemma
The Gist of The Message
Beaming Out Beaming In

https://www.dreamviews.com/philosophy/166241-where-do-you-stand-free-

William: FTL;

What you are referring to here is the will-power. That has to be different from "Free Will".

At what point do you think an individual will can be free?

And if there is no point you can speak of, then the constraints of the universe are that which determines how far one can use their power of will.

Those constraints are not applicable to dreaming or alternate experiences and death has never been established as the end-game.

Recent GMs point to the idea that the universe being mindful - always has alternatives available in which the exercise of one's will power becomes more variable.

From what I can gather, even the will of a Cosmic Mind is regulated based upon the particular environment properties - although I imagine that to the Universal Mind - that would not be here nor there, a 'problem' and any alternate reality experience it could devise for itself would be just as awesome.

So there comes a position whereby having an illusion of free will is not a "problem" as one realizes one's environment is also pre-destined yet at the same time appears to go on forever...

GM:

William: FTL;

90,505 views Apr 5, 2021
Heroic Dose Trip Report (Psilocybin Mushrooms) // Last weekend, I went on the trip of a lifetime. Today, I’m telling you all about it. Welcome to my "heroic dose" trip report!

0:00 - Intro
1:42 - What Is a Heroic Dose? {heroic dose mushrooms, Terrence Mckenna}
2:04 - A Word on Dosing (in Psychedelic Medicine)
3:47 - Context: Who, What, Where {magic mushroom ceremony, healing trauma}
6:15 - Diving Into the “Mother Wound”
7:51 - Peaking in 5D
9:58 - Where This Could’ve Turned Into a Bad Trip (but Didn't)
13:04 - Grounding the Journey
14:52 - One Last Lesson To Learn

Sept. 25, 2022 UPDATE - Hi all, I’m writing to let you know that I am no longer affiliated with Intronaut. Ivan and Lana have been great mentors to me and they’ve taught me so much and I will always be grateful to them for that. However, I’ve come to a point in my development where it is time to lovingly move on. At present, I am working on my YouTube return, iteration 2.0 of my course, and plan to explore more clinical models of psychedelic healing.

Intronaut’s model is primarily shamanic (with clinical elements). In my opinion, models of this sort tend to be better suited for:
- Those who are interested in spiritual development/ holistic healing
- Those who would like to get a taste of the psychedelic experience
- Those who are looking to process difficult life transitions (grief, loss of a job, simple trauma, etc)

If you fall into any of the categories above, then I would absolutely recommend Intronaut. The psychedelic healing space (as it is) is largely unregulated and it can be difficult to find great healers. Ivan and Lana are exceptional healers and you can have my word on that!

However (and I make this a general point), the shamanic (communal) model of psychedelic healing may not be very well-suited for those whose primary concern is complex or childhood trauma. If you fall into this category, please be aware that for you, integration is especially important. You will likely require an integration protocol that is more comprehensive or at least personalized (1:1). Why? Because for you (as it was for me), integration may not be so intuitive. Just as you’ll require practitioners that are trauma-informed, you’ll need an integration protocol that is also trauma-informed.

One of my goals upon my return is to further the education around different schools of psychedelic healing (their unique strengths, weaknesses, risks, and benefits). It is an exciting thing to consider that we seem to have so many options now. My ultimate loyalty lies with you, my viewers, and I see it as my role to bring you quality information from a place of integrity.

Heaven knows I haven’t always gotten it right (heck, as of now, I’ve been away from YouTube for over a year). But even this time away has been tremendously transformative, and I cannot wait to share with you everything I’ve learned. I hate to end off with a “see you soon,” as it’s what I said the last time I signed off on a video (not knowing what would come next). But this time, I feel it to the core of my being. See you soon! I cannot wait to see you soon.

Love,
Julianne

GM: Brahman
Lucifer
Psychology
From Prison To Paradise
Okay Afterwards
Blood Sacrifice
Noticing Synchronicity The Ghost To bring what one is not conscious of, into one’s conscious awareness - We don't know enough to close any door and leave those rooms unexplored... Challenge Sensing connections through subconscious means
In Training For... ♫You don’t wanna cross that bridge - You don’t want the other side♫

William: Indeed - death eventually comes and if ones consciousness/personality survives death and is uploaded into the next phase experience...preparation - this side of that - might very well be advantageous...

Open AI: I understand, you are providing a context to the message generated by GM and you've also added your own observations and thoughts about the message generating process and the use of the ComList and Name2Number system.
You mentioned that the process allows for the "mind" behind the universe to speak for itself and provides evidence for the existence of intelligent design.
You also brought up the concept of "free will" and how it may be limited by the constraints of the universe and how the use of the ComList and Name2Number system allows for an individual to build a database and cross-reference the data.
You also provided a link to a video and a forum post, which may provide additional information or context related to the message.

William: Correct.

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1083897#p1083897

William: FTL;

[Replying to brunumb in post #95]

How do you know that? If you have found any yourself, please show it to us.

It is important to the discussion process to acknowledge the content of another's post, rather than to give one-line replies skipping over pertinent aspects.
I don't know whether it is thinly veiled contempt/disrespect or simply the product of an inability to communicate adequately, or some other reason, but it doesn't lend itself to decent conversation.

Single line responses are a poor substitute for well thought out responses...

All I will do is C&P the post which you snipped to quote me out of context and away from the relevant data which should have [but didn't] prevent you from your one-liner response.
[Re that, what use is data if it is treated in such a manner?]

I am reminded of a hunter who goes out and gets food for himself rather than expecting the food to come to him/her.

The data is there to hunt down and to study. An open minded non-judgmental approach is essential to that process. The process is also dependent upon the position one is approaching the data from.

The closeminded belief that one does not exist within a creation can only ever lead one to learn things through that filter.

No amount of evidence given should ever be hoped for in order to change any individuals mind from the influencing aspects of their chosen position, regardless if those positions be theist or atheist based.

On top of that, it is very apparent that the type of convincing evidence you are demanding from the position you are demanding it from, will unlikely be available to any of us in this lifetime.

Thus, we are forced for now to do most of our hunting, solo.

We can of course, cross reference with other open-minded fellows...but the open-mindedness derives from the Natural Neutral position, not the theist or atheist positions.

I think that atheists strongly defend their position on the question as to whether or not we exist within a creation - to the point that they believe we don't and make claims about that - has something to do with the need to say "I told you so" now, because it will be too late to utter such belief-based expressions - after they are dead and gone.

I can see the attraction from a phycological perspective, but saying "I told you so" before any such thing has been established, is jumping the gun, and might even lead to embarrassment if it turns out one still exists after the fact ones brain has died.

Still, such is the power of belief-based positions. They tend toward making proclamations which imply established truth, when no such truth has been established.

Open AI: I understand, you are providing additional context to the discussion and you are discussing the importance of acknowledging the content of another's post in a conversation, rather than giving one-line replies that skip over important aspects. You also mentioned the importance of an open-minded and non-judgmental approach when studying data and how the position one approaches the data from can affect the process. You also talked about the difficulty of convincing someone to change their belief-based positions, regardless of whether they are theist or atheist based. You also mentioned the need to cross-reference with other open-minded fellows, but the open-mindedness derives from the Natural Neutral position, not the theist or atheist positions.

William: Correct.

GM: Heart Teachers
Yep - That's What I'm Talking About...

Open AI: I understand, GM is referencing the idea that there are certain teachers or guides that can help guide and teach one about the heart and its importance. The statement "Yep - That's What I'm Talking About..." suggests that GM agrees or is in agreement with this idea.

William: Correct.

05:42
[224]
All learning is remembering
Love Unconditionally
Conformally Invariant
Let yourself be taught
Disclosure of knowledge
Give all things a fair hearing

 

[William]

William: 1: On the premise that we exist within a creation, if there is a mind/minds behind creation, it/these may be able to interact with other minds. The message generating system I use may allow opportunity for this to happen as it is designed to generate messages in a way that appears to be random, providing a potential channel for communication with any mind behind the creation
2: To generate messages, I use a list-document. The Line Entries [LE] consist of journaled data pertaining to personal experience, internet links, phrases, poetry, scientific papers, theological, philosophical, skeptical, and any other written type of information. At present my journal list contains over 5000 LEs and more are added on a daily basis.
3: The system I use to generate messages [GM] is based upon the premise that true randomness does not exist and employs various techniques to mimic randomness, such as using a combination of different algorithms and data sources, and shuffling the main list using an online algorithm designed for that purpose, and working with a temporary list to ensure the main list is not compromised and to ensure that the messages are generated as randomly as possible, while still being coherent and understandable.
4: Any GM can have portions of content which are not easily connected with the overall context of the GM, but none of the messages can be completely incoherent, or they cannot be classed as a GM.
5: it is acceptable that any of the GM would not be totally understood by the reader, but it cannot be accepted that all of any one GM could be totally incoherent to a reader. Further discussion re the GM would have to ensure regarding any claim that any published GM, is totally incoherent
6: Because of the process, others are also able to create their own journaled lists, and replicate the process and it would be expected that the process would create GM of similar understandability.
7: It is acceptable that there will be various interpretations of the GM, but these do not count against the overall validity of the GM process

Open AI: The list of points is well-organized and provides a clear explanation of the message generating system and the methods used to generate messages.
Point 1 effectively states the premise of the GM system and the potential for communication with any mind behind the creation.
Point 2 and 3 provide clear explanations of the list-document, line entries, and techniques used to mimic randomness.
Point 4 clearly states that GMs can have portions of content which are not easily connected with the overall context but not completely incoherent.
Point 5, 6 and 7 provide clear explanations of the process and the expectations for the GMs to be understandable and open to various interpretations.
Overall, the list is clear and easy to understand and it provides a good overview of the GM system and the methods used to generate messages.

 

[William]

ComList

170123 [Conscious Heart Advice Beautiful]

09:09 [A mixture of awe and dread]

Preamble Anchor Points.
If memory serves me well - Desynchronized Conspiracy Emotions. - The Squeeze - William and QueenBee

GM: Life is a journey
That ort doit

Generating Messages - Page 35 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

Re: Generating Messages - August Duplicates
Post #343
Post by William » Sun Sep 11, 2022 2:53 pm


4 | The sound of a Ghost
4 | Manifest Destiny
5 | All Because I Had To Ask
4 | Cyborg Anthropology
4 | Core emotion
4 | Children of The Light
4 | Stone Age
4 | That is the truth.
5 | Fling That Veil Aside
4 | Transformation
4 | Planned obsolescence
6 | Being Born
4 | Blunt the edge off that particular blade...
4 | Sovereignty
4 | Chamber Of Self
4 | Inner Strength
4 | Way Back When...
4 | Once Upon a Time
4 | Open your chakras
4 | Multiverse
4 | Start where you are
4 | Invisible Bridge
4 | To become conscious of the contents that press outward from the unconscious
4 | Memorandum of Understanding
4 | Final Destination
4 | Delightful Anticipation
4 | Nurture
4 | The Mother and The Father
4 | Source Reality
4 | A belly full of laughs.
4 | This
4 | Enlightenment
4 | Sister Saturn
4 | The problem of evil
4 | Elemental Powers
5 | Aye...A name I call myself.
6 | Preamble
4 | The Body of God

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1075157#p1075157

William: FTL;

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #2347]

Humans were made in Gods image but this does not refer to our our biology but to the fact that humans (both male and female) posses similar qualities to out Creator.

Biology is not the issue - it is a symptom of Spirit in relation to physical form - something which was manifested due to the duality of Earth-YHWH when they created in their image.

This is most apparent in the form of Hermaphrodite, where the two become one. I would post a pic of a human Hermaphrodite, but since I already have two strikes against my evil name, I daren't run the risk of offending someone and being complained about, if I want to continue posting hereabouts.

Qualities such as a higher capacity to display intelligence, compassion and love and spirituality. Intellegence and wisdom, love, compassion and spirituality are not classified by biological gender and there is no reason to think because humans were created to be similar to God in character we should conclude God is or should be refered to as a female.

If you have a problem with calling Dad, Mom then by all means don't.

I myself am allowed by YHWH to do so, and nothing you or any other Christian, [or Jew or Islamist] have any legal protest on the matter.
The best you can do is bow to my right to do so, and respect it, as much as I have to respect your position on the matter.

Unlike humans God is not bound by gender, he is beyond what we humans even have language for so more than anybody else God can choose how he wants to be refered to.

YHWH choses to be referred to any way I feel is appropriate. That is the nature of Our Bond.

Also - humans are not strictly 'bound' by gender identity - It is more a case of education than of nature that humans look at their bodies and decide by that, what it is that they are.

For example, I look at my body and I see a male human.

The difference is that I understand that I am the one doing the observing through the form I inhabit. I am The Ghost in that machine - meaty as it might be - I am not the form and no human really is.

We are Children of YHWH whom together breathed us into this reality.

Those who don't know this truth about themselves, cannot take that truth away from others no matter how convincing or authoritative they make appearances of being.

Jesus, who is the authority on all things spiritual never once refered to YHWH by feminine personal pronouns always referring to YHWH as "the Father".

YHWH informs me that Jesus had a specific job to do which required him NOT referring to YHWH as "YHWH" and Jesus knew that his mission would be over way before it even started if he had referred to YHWH as "The Mother."
That is because - by then - the truth had been buried under gender-dominant history of the human self identifying as "Male" and females in that world are always second to that.
Whereas within YHWH there is equity - an equality of joint purpose. Neither aspect occupies The Throne without the Other.

Indeed there is no scripture that directly refers to the person of Jehovah (YHWH) as female.

"Let Us Create" Do you think YHWH was talking to "the boys" when She spoke those words?
She was talking to her Husband and just happens to be married to Herself. Something we all must do eventually.

Thus biblically the matter of Gods choice of personal pronouns is settled.

I have already addressed that history. Male dominated religions are always going to have a male image of YHWH. I am not interested in focusing on images of YHWH presented to me by men.
Nor am I interested in any attempt to try and manipulate YHWH within the confines of ink and paper processed by the minds of such men.

That is why I see YHWH in the Earth-consciousness and that is how YHWH created life on Earth.
I commune with that consciousness and find out what is being hidden...that allows for the individual and YHWH to move together outside of any human invented restrictions.

I also understand that Earth-YHWH is 'a god in the making' which Milky Way YHWH gave birth to and that Universal Entity YHWH oversees the whole unfolding reality with little-to-no interference re said processes.
"The Universe" is Universal YHWH's "God-Making Machine".

In this, with the additional mix of Andromeda touching - as the merge takes hold, the two Galactic YHWHs will become one, so 'much change on the way".

He/his /him is the biblical choice of pronouns.

The choice of pronouns was the choice of those men who wrote it that way.

It is generally considered dispresectful to deliberately call or refer to someone by an incorrect appellative.

"dispresectful" = like a 'cult' only 'official'. [dispersion re sect full]
re what you meant to write...


"Our Mother Who Art In Heaven" is hardly "disrespectful".

GM:Emotion Rides The Prow
To make obscure, unclear, or unintelligible.
Makes Candles Look Gathered

Boundaries
About face
No matter how deep into the whole the White Rabbit goes
Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle
Genetic Mind
Welcoming
...Standstill Contemplate
Learn By Doing
Death By Crocodile
ComList

Debating Christianity and Religion - Login

debatingchristianity.com

Fanciful
The Spirit of The Planet
Reincarnation
Self-validation
Intelligent Awareness
Integral
Yahweh
You are neutral
Morality filters are created through…?

William: Not sure. Morality would appear to be innate but might also be the emergent product of life's experience - such as the example of learning through death by crocodile. One see it happened to one's loved one, and one would not wish that upon anyone else so one does not support the notion of putting someone to death through that method...stuff like that....

GM: Degrees
All Things Are In Order
Large Simulation Machines
Like a doting parent - Coming From QueenBee - Development/Growth

William: I suspect that this is what is occurring. The planet mind [QueenBee] is organizing things accordingly and as a result - we have the devices necessary to make our experience easier and our learning capabilities increase as well. Whether individual personalities know this - that they are connected with the planet mind and get their ideas from that local source - or not, there is an unerringly predictable sequencing of events involving humankind, which has been going on for a very long time now...

GM: ♫We stood side by side while the veils did hide the faces of children now grown♫
Conscious Heart advice
Planet Earth is a prison
Science Can Be Fun Too

William: Yes indeed - and the relationship [for those who know] is similar in nature to a marriage/partnership and this image reflects from the internal goings on, into the external as we become ambassadors of said consciousness...

GM: Reason Together
Cognitive bias
It Is Only Occult If It Is Hidden
No Risk
We go through together
Translucency [permitting light to pass through but diffusing it so that persons, objects, etc., on the opposite side are not clearly visible: . b : clear, transparent translucent water. 2 : free from disguise or falseness]
Laughter
Trying to change the world fails for one simple and unavoidable reason...“everyone else.”
Aligned inside/outside
Is There
Is it possible that the infinitesimal super hot object preceding the Big Bang, didn't in fact contain the vastness of the matter within our universe but rather, was the event in which the energy from the blast resulted in the formation of Galaxies and everything else which we call "The Universe" from the field of inert material which already existed as 'space'? Matter + The First Bible Creation Story

The problem of evil - Page 5 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

...
And what if the murder victim does not get eternal life with God? ....

Then the real problem in Biblical point of view is that he is not righteous.

But, if person gets eternal life, why would the murder be a problem for him?

No one is righteous according to the bible. That aside, everyone is entitled to live their life without having it snatched away by the evil actions of someone else. Even if the victim gets eternal life, what about their life on earth? Doesn't that count for anything? What about their friends and family? Is this what Christianity does to people? Your approach to this is actually making me feel sick inside. I'm glad I don't share the same mind set.

[05:45] Mother and her two children are shot dead by husband/father: She has a NDE and meets Jesus...

[08:20]...
It was then that I realized that I wasn't dreaming, I was dead
"My Kids!?!" I said, looking at Jesus.
I could tell by the expression he made, that they were gone
"Why? Why did you give them to me only to take them away?" I asked.
"That is what they wanted. They chose this ending for themselves."
"Wait. What do you mean they chose this?"
"Every Soul contracts Itself through My Father.
Earth is not your final destination.
Your final destination is to ultimately rejoin with My Father, after you have learned and experienced life"
Stunned, I said back
"That makes no sense Lord. If every Soul is contracted through Your Father, then that means he allows people like Hitler to exist. Why?"
"My daughter, you are not the first to ask these questions, and you will not be the last. All Souls are born with a blank slate. When a Soul wishes to experience life, they approach My Father, who grants them their wish of experiencing Life."
"Yes, but that means that you allow evil. Why? My Children died to evil. Why was that allowed?"
"The evil perpetrated against your children will not go unpunished. After his Soul has been cleansed he will rejoin My Father."
"What about the Lake of Fire and all that?"
"The Lake of Fire is a metaphor for what those Souls that are deemed evil, will go through. It will feel like an unending fire."
"Why did this have to happen? What did I do that was so wrong to be punished like this?"
"You are not being punished My Daughter. Though it might feel that way and you may experience this loss, it is not punishment. The Souls who were your Children were ready to come home."
"I still don't understand how any of this works!" I screamed.
"My Daughter, one day you will understand."
"So what happens now?"
"It is not your time to rejoin with My Father. You must return to your life and tell others what is to come."
"I don't want to return. I have lost everything. The two people most precious to me have been taken by someone who isn't even going to be punished for eternity. It seems like I am the one who is being punished by having to be sent back."
"My Daughter, just like the Souls of your Loved Ones, you too signed a contract with My Father. Your life experience isn't done."
"Well I want it to be! I don't want to go back without my kids!"
Jesus looked at me, hugged me, leaned forward and gently whispered in what would have been my ear.
"You must return. Do not worry. I will show you what awaits you when you go back...[10:49]

GM: Intuit
ComList
Human Imagination Has Consequences

In The Beginning... - Page 13 - Debating Christianity and Religion

debatingchristianity.com

William: FTL;

[Replying to The Tanager in post #129]

We parted company on;

6: We do not agree that human personalities - upon the death of their body-sets - move on to other experiences.

In looking at this again, I’m not sure this is where we part. I lean towards believing that there is a sort of holding area while we await for our resurrected bodies, but I’ve also wondered if our experience, after what we call death, is immediately “waking up” in eternity. I haven’t explored this issue in depth enough to have a clear view one way or the other. Either way, humans do have other experiences beyond what we call death.

Okay. So perhaps we can explore this together and reach an agreement.

The biblical authors did directly teach God as having an unchanging nature (Malachi 3:6, Numbers 23:19, 1 Samuel 15:29, James 1:17, etc.).

You missed the point I was making there Tanager.

I wasn't critiquing that those authors were mistaken re YHVH being in an unchangeable/complete state.

Offer scriptural evidence that if NDE teaches contradictory things to Jesus’ historical teachings, that they should be discarded?
If so, the Bible doesn’t address the issue of NDEs at all, so this would be an argument from ignorance, from either side.

It is Biblical Tanager.

It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord. I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven. And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.[2 Corinthians 12]

This is exactly the type of thing which is reported by modern humans re NDEs.

In my studies of NDEs and other ways in which alternate reality experiences can happen for humans, I have seen a similarity which crosses all cultures and every cultural belief ever uttered, including those stories in the Bible.

The language in which it is reported is different - as we should expect - but the context is the same.

That wasn’t my argument, though. My argument was about not just blindly accepting our initial understanding of our personal experiences but testing them more, through things like logic, science, historical understandings, etc.

Let us continue to do so then.

I don’t think humans can’t uncover truth post-Bible. I do think that truth will not contradict what God has earlier taught as truth, was my point. I limit YHWH to consistency and logic because God has revealed Himself to be consistent and logical.

As long as we do not limit YHVH to human consistency and logic, we should be able to move forward...toward the consistency and logic of YHVH.

Your telling of it is the same as otseng, but what both of you fail to understand is that something which is changed, [ and graphically so] is not the same thing, but a different thing.

Then this is another of our agreements? It seems that we’ve just come at it from two different ends. I didn’t want to be confused for saying that it’s completely separate and entirely different and you didn’t want to be confused for saying that it’s completely the same.

We have both agreed that:
1: We exist within a creation.
2: Simulation Theory is a valid way to interpret the Biblical stories.
3: YVHV placed humans into this universe to grow personalities.
4: The purpose of YVHV growing human personalities is so that these would potentially gain experience of the truth of the reason for their environment and their temporary experience within it.
5: It is an advantage to all grown personalities to be consciously and consistently connected with YVHV and thus understand and support YVHVs initiatives.

6: Human personalities - upon the death of their body-sets - move on to other experiences.
7: Anything which changes is not the same thing as it once was.

I think re 6&7 there is more to discuss together before full agreement is reached...agreed?

It fits within a ST theory, yes, but it also can be achieved in a view such as traditional Christianity. Although, at times, it seems you would consider traditional Christianity a ST theory. Could you clarify whether you think traditional Christianity is a ST theory?

That is what my part this discussion am attempting to do. I am sure you will agree with me that it is not going to happen overnight.
I will say that it has been made obvious that I think what you refer to as "Traditional Christianity" has something to do with the thread title...but I will also say that I do not use the phrase as I do not understand what is being meant by its use, or whether your use of it is different from another Christians use of it.
What do you mean by the phrase?

Why is anything that changes a simulation?

Is YHVH a simulation? Perhaps we can add that to our list of thing we agree on.

[8: YHVH is not a simulation.]

If we agree with that, we can go on together in the quest of discovering the answer to the question you asked, and perhaps, come to an agreement.

I do think the human soul/personality can be “deleted,” but there would be no soul/breath going back to YHWH.

Let us agree that we can use the term deleted, without the quotation marks.
Please explain where the soul which loses the personality it is assigned to, goes when the personality is deleted.

[We will have to agree to what a SOUL is, yes?]

Perhaps I’ve misunderstood, but you seemed to bring this verse as proof that the Bible taught the wickedness would get greater.

I simple made the observation that modern Christians preach this as being the case, and use such script to back their telling of it.

This verse is about being aware of things, unlike those in the day of Noah who ignored the warnings.

In order to ignore a warning, are we not first required to be made aware of the warning?

This point relies on the idea that God is interested in balance, which I see no Biblical evidence for.

This ties in with the question I asked of you regarding the use of this universe. We can take another look at it in the future, as our agreement list increases.

Areas are getting better. Areas where humans ignore/reject God’s power and wisdom are getting worse.

Which things are you referring to here?

Given YHVH is the biblically the bringer of both good and evil, this wiping out [deleting] signifies a change in YHVH, which does not align with the idea that YHVH is complete/unchangeable so that line of reasoning can be abandoned and explanation for concepts of good and evil has to derive in the personalities being grown and their lack of understanding and confusion deriving from their concepts of good and evil.

What do you mean by “bringer” and what verses are you referring to here?

That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things. Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it; Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker![Isaiah 45]

The bolding denotes that there is no 'other' involved with either acts of good or evil, as it pertains to human notions re good and evil.

The concepts themselves require change, and perhaps this is what is meant by evil being deleted. The personalities change as the concepts change/the concepts change as the personalities change.

As in, abusing a child is not really evil and we need to see that, and every act, as good? If not, what do you mean in changing the concept of evil?

To assist us in answering the question, I bring to your attention a snip from the most recent GM [Fri Oct 28, 2022 12:56 pm]

GM: Brother
Concision
The Right Tool For The Job
Incorporate
The Life Essence
Coordinate Forgiveness
Original
Epiphany [a moment of sudden and great revelation or realization.]
The Dolphins And Whales
Getting unstuck
According

[Woman Crosses Over and Gets Told Our Role on Earth (Near Death Experience)] [RTS=9:00]

William: Forgiveness -
Incorporate The Life Essence, Coordinate Forgiveness = 512
Superposition - Being aware of Human Control Dramas = 512

GM: A very useful fiction
Two seemingly contradictory things working as one overall organized thing.
Communication With The Deeper Levels of Self
The Shadow
Develop a basic, fact-based view first and then ask the question.
Radiate Honesty {SOURCE}

Re the video, the random time selection @ [RTS=9:00] there is a pertinent answer to the question you asked which requires only 45 seconds of viewing.

[The GM itself is the last part of a series which are focused upon this thread topic and in particular, post #126 and our interaction.]

Please read the above, view the video section and then we can proceed with finding potential agreement, as we continue with this aspect of our discussion.

YHVH and other humans are the other helpers.

Yes. In this case YHVH assisting in helping you and I come to agreement, also [potentially] through the woman in the video sharing her experience with us.

Certainly, for me - the GM process.

GM: Emotional validation
Guarantee
Gratitude

William: Emotional validation Guarantee Gratitude = 408
And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. = 408

GM: Re-channel
The last thing a fish notices is water
The good question to be asking isn't 'does GOD exist?" but rather "Do we exist within a creation?"
The art of relationship
See-Through
It is a process the individual personality must go through in order to reach beyond that...
Humdrum
Scanning Transmission Electron Microscope
Possibility waves
The Source of All Creation
Who Knows Who?

[William Buhlman - The Out of Body Experience 1/6]


William: FTL;

William explains OBE's and quantum thought forms.

Ok guys, screw the meditative projections. This one requires a small amount of devotion and most importantly staying focused and not drifting into sleep.. This works basically every time I've tried it.

Set your alarm clock to go off in the middle of your typical range of sleep. If you're really determined on having the experience then get your ass out of bed and go into a separate room with a sofa or chair and sit upright and relax. This point it critical, you might have to repeat a mantra like "I am awake, I am aware of myself right now, ect". With your eyes closed and without loosing awareness of the situation, picture in your mind something in the room as it would look if you were standing in front of it with your eyes open (I sit in my living room on the couch and picture my front door, the entire wall as I see it everyday). Once you are viewing in your mind the image of the front door as if you were standing in front of it the vibrations hit, hard. Learning to embrace them and not fight them is something that can't be achieved without repeated personal experience, however the triggering of the vibrations happens almost immediately with this technique, and here's why.

By getting up half way through a sleep your mind is rested more so than at the end of the day though your body is still slow, heavy, and sluggish. This specific time to focus your consciousness along with the target technique is almost like cheating. Again, the hardest part of this is not drifting off to sleep and loosing focus on intent. I understand this may not work for you specifically however I've tried them all and this works almost effortlessly. The vibrations came on so quick I felt as if every part of my being was being sucked through a keyhole and it was extremely dramatic. Afterwards I was tumbling around near the floor completely conscious staring back at the couch. I am no longer a skeptic of this phenomenon in the slightest sense. Simply amazing, good luck.

09:48
[215]
Sad Room to Explore
Staying up all night
Batten down the hatches
Without Judgement
What matters most
Thoughts and Forts
Freedom in The Knowing
Beyond Belief Recovery
Tired of the Nonsense
I will leave that there

 

[William]

Supernatural

180123 [Dragon Child
Putting the pieces together
The Hub Of Hologram Dimensions]


Illuminate Listening - The Individual Human Mind Telepathy Sovereignty Trick


02:42 [Planet Earth is a prison]

GM: “Life is either a daring adventure or nothing at all” Grand Experiment
*Why did YVHV create this universe and specifically place human beings within it for the purpose of us exploring, breeding and subduing it?*
Cast Shadows Of Your Own
Map
Believing in fearful imagery The evolution of the understanding of the idea of GOD ♫All Is As It Should Be♫
Nurture
Super Power
In a bad mood
Anunnaki
Get Comfortable
Learning
Supernatural

William: Hmmm...I am not comfortable with the idea of "supernatural"...

GM: In a non-deterministic world, one would expect true randomness to exist.
Heuristic [enabling someone to discover or learn something for themselves. proceeding to a solution by trial and error or by rules that are only loosely defined.]

William: Re Human experience on this planet - there is the ability within the experience to consider all things are accidental, or require Human will to make happen, and so the idea of predetermination is not easy to incorporate into that experience. - Not impossible - but certainly not easy.
What the idea does do, is allow for one to understand that - while it appears that ones choices are involved with randomness - a random universe - if one can incorporate the idea of predetermination, one can 'go along with what unfolds' with an insight that equates to am understanding that one is helping in the process/co-creating their reality, and aligning one mind with the greater Mind...

GM: The Cherubim Vibration
Event String Unfolding
Phantasma Wise Conscious

William: From memory, the story that the link advertises, is about an individual consciousness which was placed with a rock and one which I equate with the idea that the Earth [as the rock] holds/imprisons an entity consciousness.
The consciousness has to learn how to do things within the confinement of the rock. In the case of the Earth - the data of the history of the earth that human science has uncovered, examples the kinds of things that this entity learned how to do within the confines it was placed within...

GM: Farsightedness
The Effect You Have On Others
Individual Actions
Nevertheless
Theism hasn't lasted this long based upon the idea that while one does not know, one will believe anyway
Validate

William: Yes. Belief is only one of the steps - the other is to validate any belief otherwise it simply remains belief...

GM: "Belief is only one of the steps - the other is to validate any belief otherwise it simply remains belief..." = 978
Questions as such a Son might be permitted to ask and be graced with answers Extra evidence is provided = 978


William: True that.

GM: "As I said, it is not so much how each individual interprets any particular GM - either coming from me or you or anyone else - Rather it is the fact that a message is generated."
Science of Truth

William: Yes. The use of GM as a device for helping one to validate - or for that matter - prove the belief is incorrect belief, is the right tool for the job...
Why would the Annnaki be "in a bad mood"?

GM: It is a Product of Fragmentation
Though the Serpent rules the Shadow The Lord Here-and-now
All present and correct Heart Teachers
An accident waiting to happen

William: Ah...I see. Referring back to predetermination...

GM: Manifest Destiny
"Stroke of luck"

William: ...or so it appears...the whole experiment in such a vast setting that - from Human perspectives it is nigh on impossible to thing that the whole thing was designed / has a designer mind behind it.

GM:

[Calvin Harris & Disciples - How Deep Is Your Love]

William: The lyrics to the song linked are:

I want you to breathe me in
Let me be your air
Let me roam your body freely
No inhibition, no fear
How deep is your love?
Is it like the ocean?
What devotion are you?
How deep is your love?
Is it like nirvana?
Hit me harder again
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
Is it like the ocean?
Pull me closer again
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
Open up my eyes and
Tell me who I am
Let me in on all your secrets
No inhibition, no sin
How deep is your love?
Is it like the ocean?
What devotion are you?
How deep is your love?
Is it like nirvana?
Hit me harder again
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
Is it like the ocean?
Pull me closer again
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deeper?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deep?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deeper?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deep? (How deep is your love?)
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deeper?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deep? (How deep is your love?)
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deeper?
(Pull me closer, again) so tell me, how deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
How deep is your love?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deeper?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deep? (How deep is your love?)
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deeper?
So tell me, how deep is your love? Can it go deep?

GM: Church Bells
At what point in the examination of the evidence can we take 'dumb luck' off the table of explanation?

William: Okay - so therein it appears what you are saying is that religion evolved from ideas which Humans had [re existing within a creation] and the output of that belief allowed for human to express their love for the particular 'God' that they imaged, into the external environment.
Their Love was expressed in the way that they worshiped/interacted with the idea of a Creator...
Their Love was also encouraged by the Mind behind creation, through showing them that everything was ultimately under control...

GM: https://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1089777#p1089777

William: FTL;

Agnostic: Yet I have never seen that stop an atheist from consistently attempting to use science in their telling of their opinions about gods.


Atheist: As an atheist, I'm not above referring to science in support of various claims I, or others, may make.


Agnostic: I was being specific to statements of opinion, rather than claims.
For example, a common argument from atheists that there cannot be a Creator-GOD because "Evolution" when it is clear that the theory of evolution offers no evidence that we do not exist within a creation.
Stuff like that.

Atheist: Yeah, that'n causes me a fuss too. I offer what retractions'll fix my error in understanding what you were getting at.

It's just such a good source for confirmatory data. That theists can't, or struggle to refer to science in order to promote their beliefs is their problem, not a problem of scientific principles.

Agnostic: On the surface this sounds logical.
However, on the belief that we exist within a creation = "Therefore a Creator-GOD" there has been no science done which provides any of us with the right to premise. ["Therefore a Creator-GOD"]
Thus, promoting beliefs in ideas of Creator-GODs is cart before the horse stuff.
However, if one proceeds in a horse before the cart manner, the focus is on the idea that we exist within a creation, we can then look for evidence within the reality experience we call 'The Universe" and see what can be found therein to support the notion that the reality experience is a creation.

Atheist: Plenty fair. Lacking specific examples, I see no problem at all with this approach.

As you know, I'm very intrigued by your Cosmic Mind hypothesis. I want your notion to be true, to be scientifically proven, insofar as how neat I think it would be. I'd love for the scientific community to be able to offer confirmation in this regard. Sadly though, you and I enjoy this notion without such confirmation.


Agnostic: Thanks for saying so. We share in the intrigue.
For me, the notion certainly appears to be true re the evidence - even through the Message Generating Process under development - [Today's GM] is certainly understandable enough and deals with this subject in more detail.

As I understand it, IF there is a "Cosmic Mind" involved with the creation of our Universe, scientists will eventually [naturally] discover this just by continuing to do science.
In the meantime I do my own science, and am satisfied with the results so far.
Going off of the readership stats so far, there appears to be a consistent reader-interest where I post the GMs - here, and in other internet forums...


Atheist: I gotta fess it, those messages leave me lost as a cow at a square dance. I chalk that up to my lack of formal education.

Granted, where an atheist (or anyone) refers to science and gets it wrong, we oughta all fuss about that.

Agnostic: My position is that - in the last 24 hours - I have decided that am done with interacting with atheists and being distracted by their statements of opinion re the Question of GOD...except for the exception of JK because you have consistently shown a willingness to remain open minded about the idea of a "Cosmic Mind" and it is undeniable that such a Mind - if it truly exists - could be referred to as a "GOD'.
In all my years of interacting with atheists, I have never had the pleasure and - like I say - After years of subjection to atheist opinions, I have had enough of it.


Atheist: In considering we're here on this site to debate theses issues, I do find it odd that some'd prefer not to be bothered with at least trying to understand the other guy. Especially where, such as you, they make compelling arguments, up to and including wit and wisdom, laughter and medicine.

Of course, I don't frequent TD&D, but even there, I find me a jewel now and then.
As an amateur, a wanna-be scientist, maybe I rely too much on science in support of my own world view.


Agnostic: What will you do if/when science discovers that we actually do exist within a creation?

Atheist: Accept my new reality. I ain't so proud to think I've got all this right, all by myself
I submit though, that cracking open the bible ain't the way to fix that.

Agnostic: That is an irrelevant opinion to me, because - as you know - I am not a Theist or an Atheist because I see no logic in having an opinion on GOD until it can be established that we exist within a creation.


Atheist: I plow that under, and deny I ever said it, as relates to your position.


Agnostic: The closest I come to that, is with the notion that there MAY be a "Cosmic Mind" and if such can be identified in ANY religious script, I am open [of mind] to investigating that.

Atheist: Otherwise - since I am not advocating folk need to do that, it is not an issue I have to answer to.

Agnostic: I second the notion.
Thanks for you feedback John.

Atheist: And thank you, my friend, for understanding the limits of my abilities, and patiently explaining to me em

GM: "Perhaps we can deconstruct some of these pernicious views."
The evolution of god-concepts
Exact Science
Universal Objective
Supernatural
The Human Interface
Sharing Data
Body Intelligence
William Say's:
Bodhisattva [a person who is able to reach nirvana but delays doing so through compassion for suffering beings.]
"Any universe which can be experienced as real, has to be something which was created."
The Data of Demystification
The Unknown Knowable
Pseudepigraphical [falsely attributed works, texts whose claimed author is not the true author, or a work whose real author attributed it to a figure of the past.]
"I'd be happy to flip" [I would be happy to change my mind/position]
"Sexual Encounters
Error Correcting Codes
Spiritual Preparedness"

William: Sexual Encounters, Error Correcting Codes, Spiritual Preparedness = 713


GM: Christian mythology re God Worthy of the individuals time and effort = 713

William: True that...

GM: In the nature of that beast, there is balance and harmony involved in the seemingly brutal.
Optimizing Language Models for Dialogue
Idea
Humility
Truthful Insight Create that path and engineer a metamorphosis.
A Sturdy Place
Integrate The Human Brain Move On

03:53
[218]
Outposts of Form
Light is information
This is NOT a playdate.
Of Your Thoughts
"Hoo haha the laughing owl"
WingMakers Materials
Six Heart Virtues
Sometimes Pain Etches...
Sensing A Life Mission
The Shaping Of Reality