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When I was a Christian, I heard many testimonies of people changing their life after they encountered religion. Most or all of these testimonies I know of come from those who converted to Christianity which is why I am starting this thread here but feel free to add on other religions. The changes I'm referring to aren't just minor things, but I'm referring to people who were in prostitution and in gangs changing to become responsible and caring people. If that's the case, then that's truly a transformation.

As an example, meet Rene "Level" Martinez

For Discussion:
1. Are there any studies that confirm these positive effects of religion?
2. Is there any non-religious philosophy or system that can and has also transformed people's lives?
3. I also open the discussion for anyone to explain how they have experienced similar transformations in their life because of religion.
4. Does the transformative power of religion support God's existence?
 
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From my own personal experience I will say that religion does not change anyone for the better. Religion is cold, impersonal, and restrictive. Religion causes more harm in the world that it does good. What affected me in a positive way was my relationship with Jesus Christ. The changes He has made in my life are incredible. I used to be a drunk who was always looking for a fight. I was a horrible husband who would stay out with the boys all night. I can now say that I no longer drink, I am faithful to my wife and the only fighting I do now is in the spiritual realm. It wasn't joining a church that changed me, it was Jesus. He created a new man out of me. He changed my heart. He put a new desire in me. There is no doubt in my heart that God exists. I know what He has done in my life.
 
From my own personal experience I will say that religion does not change anyone for the better. Religion is cold, impersonal, and restrictive. Religion causes more harm in the world that it does good. What affected me in a positive way was my relationship with Jesus Christ. The changes He has made in my life are incredible. I used to be a drunk who was always looking for a fight. I was a horrible husband who would stay out with the boys all night. I can now say that I no longer drink, I am faithful to my wife and the only fighting I do now is in the spiritual realm. It wasn't joining a church that changed me, it was Jesus. He created a new man out of me. He changed my heart. He put a new desire in me. There is no doubt in my heart that God exists. I know what He has done in my life.
Thanks for sharing! That's a good point about religion. We can't forget that there are plenty of religious folks that do horrible things. Something more is needed than just rules and rituals. As a non-Christian I don't know that it's God, but I think having a belief that there is one or just a belief that there is something greater than yourself to aspire to or to even love is a big factor.
 
When I was a Christian, I heard many testimonies of people changing their life after they encountered religion. Most or all of these testimonies I know of come from those who converted to Christianity which is why I am starting this thread here but feel free to add on other religions. The changes I'm referring to aren't just minor things, but I'm referring to people who were in prostitution and in gangs changing to become responsible and caring people. If that's the case, then that's truly a transformation.

As an example, meet Rene "Level" Martinez

For Discussion:
1. Are there any studies that confirm these positive effects of religion?
2. Is there any non-religious philosophy or system that can and has also transformed people's lives?
3. I also open the discussion for anyone to explain how they have experienced similar transformations in their life because of religion.
4. Does the transformative power of religion support God's existence?
I suggest that “existence” is a poor metric for the One Who causes to exist, which implies “objective evidence” right. I mean i know we use that as a metaphor for “real” now, but existence actually gets us to only like 5% of everything that we know must be real.
2. AA i guess, not that im a buyer, but it works for some apparently
 
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I suggest that “existence” is a poor metric for the One Who causes to exist, which implies “objective evidence” right. I mean i know we use that as a metaphor for “real” now, but existence actually gets us to only like 5% of everything that we know must be real.
That's interesting to think about. If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that it would be better to look at why things exist in the first place, instead of just going by what exists or trying to find out what exists (whether it be God or something else).

Feel free to elaborate!

If you are saying that not everything that exists (or that we think exists) is real, then I can agree with you there. But the path I want to take is being able to reliably know what about the things that exists.
 
I suggest that “existence” is a poor metric for the One Who causes to exist, which implies “objective evidence” right. I mean i know we use that as a metaphor for “real” now, but existence actually gets us to only like 5% of everything that we know must be real.
That's interesting to think about. If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that it would be better to look at why things exist in the first place, instead of just going by what exists or trying to find out what exists (whether it be God or something else).

Feel free to elaborate!

If you are saying that not everything that exists (or that we think exists) is real, then I can agree with you there. But the path I want to take is being able to reliably know what about the things that exists.
i guess according to a scientist it would be closer to the opposite, not everything that is real (or that we think is real) exists, and apparently not by a really long shot. I mean we still label it, with names like dark matter and dark energy, but we know that those make up prolly over 95%! Existence accounts for 5, iow.

now it might also be true that not everything that exists (objective evidence) will turn out to be real, by way of some misunderstanding, etc, but a point might be that even reliably knowing about the things that exist will only get you to 5%
 
i guess according to a scientist it would be closer to the opposite, not everything that is real (or that we think is real) exists, and apparently not by a really long shot. I mean we still label it, with names like dark matter and dark energy, but we know that those make up prolly over 95%! Existence accounts for 5, iow.
True. Scientists don't really know what dark matter is. Hek, they don't even know what matter is if you pressed them. Matter is usually defined in terms of its properties, like it has mass and occupies space. That's like defining a human in terms of its weight and height.

2. AA i guess, not that im a buyer, but it works for some apparently
Yes, I've heard that AA works for some. I suppose if most of someone's life revolved around alcohol, then being able to ditch that by attending AA would be a big change. What I'd want answers for is if such a change is on the same scale as the religious transformations we hear about. If not, what's the difference. The religious might say that religion goes to the heart/soul, while other non-religious systems might only deal with your thoughts/behaviors (but not inner most desires?).

Wish we had more atheists here to contribute!
 
i guess according to a scientist it would be closer to the opposite, not everything that is real (or that we think is real) exists, and apparently not by a really long shot. I mean we still label it, with names like dark matter and dark energy, but we know that those make up prolly over 95%! Existence accounts for 5, iow.
True. Scientists don't really know what dark matter is. Hek, they don't even know what matter is if you pressed them. Matter is usually defined in terms of its properties, like it has mass and occupies space. That's like defining a human in terms of its weight and height.
interesting to me how much of that is now being defined as just interactions of electrons; color, physical properties, etc. weird
2. AA i guess, not that im a buyer, but it works for some apparently
Yes, I've heard that AA works for some. I suppose if most of someone's life revolved around alcohol, then being able to ditch that by attending AA would be a big change. What I'd want answers for is if such a change is on the same scale as the religious transformations we hear about. If not, what's the difference. The religious might say that religion goes to the heart/soul, while other non-religious systems might only deal with your thoughts/behaviors (but not inner most desires?).
imo AA v Rational Recovery is quite similar to Believers v Agnostics. Many or most AAers seem to be mostly dry drunks, never really overcoming? And the Bible has plenty to say about believers in that same vein i guess
Wish we had more atheists here to contribute!
i know a possible candidate, but as a rule most declared ones seem to be so gnostic that a discussion is fairly hard to have imo
 
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i know a possible candidate, but as a rule most declared ones seem to be so gnostic that a discussion is fairly hard to have imo
Cant forget that going from atheism to Christianity is also a big change. It highlights the degree of change involved. I know of a few atheist (maybe they were agnostic) that went to Christianity for intellectual reasons although they didn't strike me as being the very involved community type Christians. To really change to a greater degree I think takes more than just committing your mind, but also your heart.
 
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i know a possible candidate, but as a rule most declared ones seem to be so gnostic that a discussion is fairly hard to have imo
Cant forget that going from atheism to Christianity is also a big change. It highlights the degree of change involved. I know of a few atheist (maybe they were agnostic) that went to Christianity for intellectual reasons although they didn't strike me as being the very involved community type Christians. To really change to a greater degree I think takes more than just committing your mind, but also your heart.
i applaud anyone who was atheist going to even Christianity, as it means they have started seeking. If they keep seeking they will see that they have just traded one race for another, and we can even witness later stage Christians debating what a “real” Christian is, right? Then they usually learn about the influence of the cult of sol

And i guess right in there somewhere it comes to light that Christian Zionism likely even predates Jewish Zionism, and what “Christian” even meant back then, to Agrippa iow, at You would almost have me convert to Christianity. Now dont get me wrong, the Centurion was given some of the highest praise by Jesus, for his faith no less, but we can even hear him more or less saying “its like this and like that,” cant we.

So, They were first called Christians in Antioch, right, https://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Antioch.html and they get special tax considerations to this day, do they not? We could also get into why Christ seems so awesome but Christians, not so much, but a big point to me is that one will eventually have to confront Father, why have You forsaken Me? Which trust me the stock answer for that is crap ok

Or OT—since nothing has changed anyway lol, except ppl, barely—why was Esau hated? How is it that Esau lost his inheritance, but he the one who stayed and got the land? Does that make sense to you?

Also in the worship of Nehushtan, and what the Snake on a Pole means, in Exodus. Jesus gonna be lifted up like a snake on a pole, right? Where the carcass is, there the vultures will gather see. Sorry that it comes out rather um disjointed, lol. But it all comes together eventually.

Anyway, Xtianity is great, imo, the highest form of spiritual philosophy we have. If the Bible might be considered to open with a critique of Kundalini (Eve under a tree of knowledge talking to a snake), it might be said to end with a critique of religion in general, as Jesus’ various comments on the religious, and even Apollos waters reveals.

Also, how hard is it iyo to relate a typical Christian’s speech patterns to “tree of knowledge of good and evil?” lol. ya. So Christianity, imo, ends up being the very best tree to be from, possibly, but it ends up having so little to do with the Bible, see. Scribes and strong men and all that, i guess